{"@context":"http://iiif.io/api/presentation/3/context.json","id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/iiif/6q1sf2np9g/manifest","type":"Manifest","label":{"en":["Eric Allman Interview with FOSSDA"]},"logo":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/204/original/FOSSDA%285%29.jpg?1666825306","metadata":[{"label":{"en":["Agent"]},"value":{"en":["Elisabetta Mori","Eric Allman"]}},{"label":{"en":["Date"]},"value":{"en":["2023-06-06"]}},{"label":{"en":["Description"]},"value":{"en":["Eric Allman interviewed by Elisabetta Mori on 6th June 2023"]}},{"label":{"en":["Format"]},"value":{"en":["MPEG-4"]}},{"label":{"en":["Keyword"]},"value":{"en":["Elisabetta Mori","FOSSDA","Eric Allman","Sendmail"]}},{"label":{"en":["Type"]},"value":{"en":["TheirStory"]}}],"summary":{"en":["Eric Allman interviewed by Elisabetta Mori on 6th June 2023"]},"provider":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/aboutus","type":"Agent","label":{"en":["Free Open Source Stories Digital Archive"]},"homepage":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/","type":"Text","label":{"en":["Free Open Source Stories Digital Archive"]},"format":"text/html"}],"logo":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/organizations/logo_images/000/000/204/original/FOSSDA%285%29.jpg?1666825306","type":"Image"}]}],"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/207/413/small/open-uri20230829-1369768-iat2mj_1693282206.jpg?1693282207","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413","type":"Canvas","label":{"en":["Media File 1 of 1 - open-uri20230829-1369768-iat2mj.mp4"]},"duration":5987.12,"width":640,"height":360,"thumbnail":[{"id":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/collection_resource_files/thumbnails/000/207/413/small/open-uri20230829-1369768-iat2mj_1693282206.jpg?1693282207","type":"Image","format":"image/jpeg"}],"items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/content/1","type":"AnnotationPage","items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/content/1/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"painting","body":{"id":"https://aviary-p-fossda.s3.wasabisys.com/collection_resource_files/resource_files/000/207/413/original/open-uri20230829-1369768-iat2mj.mp4?1693282196","type":"Video","format":"video/mp4","duration":5987.12,"width":640,"height":360},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413","metadata":[]}]}],"annotations":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["TheirStory Transcript (Paragraphs with Speakers) [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/1","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Welcome to FOSSDA, the Free and Open Source Stories Digital Archive Foundation. It's the 6th of June, 2023, and I am Elisabetta Mori, a historian of computing currently based in Italy, and an oral history interviewer with FOSSDA. Today, I'll be talking to software engineer, Eric Allman, author of the mail transfer agent, Sendmail. We are recording on TheirStory.io, and I am in Rio, in Elba, in Elba Island, Italy, and Eric is in Berkeley, California. Welcome, Eric.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5.22,44.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/2","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Thank you. Thank","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=45.54,46.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/3","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e you for being here today. Where and when were you born?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=46.86,52.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/4","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was born in Oakland, which is the next town over from Berkeley. And back in 1955, which I sometimes wonder how old I'm getting to be now, and moved when I was about two and a half, three maybe, to El Cerrito, which is a town on the other side of Berkeley. And then at some point I moved into Berkeley. So I've been, I think of myself as a Berkeley boy through. Hello?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=55.08,88.79"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/5","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, hi. We had a glitch there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=102.88,105.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/6","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay. So, can you describe your parents?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=105.54,109.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/7","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Sure, my mother was a basically spent her life in education. She was a school teacher originally in the Head Start program and later became a regular classroom teacher and at some point got her master's degree and moved up to the principal role, which she did for the rest of her career. My father was, when I was born, was an adman for the Richmond Independent, which was a local paper, long gone now. And at some point he and my mother divorced, and so I'm not as completely clear about what he was doing after that, but he stayed in advertising for a while and wrote a newspaper column called Art Who, which was an art critic column, and at some point kind of retired and was at that point just sort of an art collector. Oh, we did art brokering for a while too. And my mother passed away a couple years ago, and my father, actually my mother passed away about five years ago, and my father passed away about two years ago, maybe three.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=111.98,213.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/8","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm sorry. What about your siblings?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=214.28,220.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/9","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I have one sister, Kat, who... How can I put this? My sister was, you know, if I was the kind of mathematical one in the family, she was the, you know, humanities person. And she had, I think, a difficult time because I was considered to be the great student and she always felt like she was in my shadow. And what's happened is, in fact, she ended up going to work at Google very early on doing open source developer relations and I don't know I think she was there 15 years, which is pretty amazing and she's recently left and I think she's still contemplating whether she wants to retire or you know go for another job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=222.18,285.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/10","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What was your family life like?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=288.68,290.534"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/11","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e My family life? Well, as I mentioned my parents got divorced when I was quite young. And so I came from what they used to call back then a broken family, although I don't think there was anything particularly broken about it. My mother was an absolutely wonderful mother who, you know, was at one point going to school, had a full time job and raising two kids by herself and never seemed to break a sweat. It was quite astounding. When she was going to school, my sister and I would sometimes, actually most of the time, spend summers at my grandparents' place. That would be her parents. And they lived out in the country in Sebastopol. So there was a, what was it, 12-acre, I think, forest to explore and so forth. So, you know, not a bad way to spend your summers. A little lonely, I guess, because they were down at the end of a dirt road and there just weren't anyone my age around. But that was fairly informative, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=291.62,366.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/12","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So which schools did you attend and what were your favorite subjects?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=368.6,372.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/13","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'll skip kindergarten. I went to actually a couple of different, we called them junior high schools. They're called middle schools now and then I ended up at El Cerrito High School which might as I've already intimated my specialties seem to be like math and science. No particularly great surprise, but, you know, I did other things too. In high school, at, I think my sister's suggestion, I got involved doing work in the theater, which was a really astounding thing. I did sound, and making sound effects was quite interesting. At one point I had to make the sound of a train crash. That was fun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=375.271,444.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/14","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e How did you do it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=445.38,447.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/15","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I went into the theater when no one was around and laid a ladder on the stage, piled chairs on top of the ladder, tied a rope around the ladder and pulled the whole thing onto the ground. I think I then, you know, slowed it down or something like that a little bit and so forth. It was pretty cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=448.26,472.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/16","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So let's talk about university. You went to University of California, Berkeley in 1973?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=474.48,483.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/17","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=484.54,485.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/18","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And you got a Bachelor in Electronic Engineering and Computer Science in 1977 and a Master of Science in Computer Science in June 1980. So what are your memories of those years?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=485.8,500.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/19","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was not a particularly happy kid in high school. You know, I did well in classes and so forth, but I never really felt connected to my peers. I think part of that, in fact, I'm sure part of it was, you know, by high school I had realized that I was gay, but I was still very much in the closet. And attitudes then were not as forgiving as they are today. And so, I kind of started over from scratch when I went to Berkeley. And I have only kept in touch with a couple of people from my high school days.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=506.04,550.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/20","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The Berkeley was great for me. It helped that I had no social life because that way I could do all of my homework. And remember, you know, physics problem set was all day Saturday and math problem set was all day Sunday. So, and I was taking computer classes. So back in high school, actually in junior high school, there was a teacher, I guess a math teacher at a different school when I was in who decided it would be cool to do an after-school program teaching kids how to program, Fortran to be precise. And I got involved with that and learned Fortran. So I already knew some computer languages when I got into Berkeley, which gave me a definite leg up because, you know, it wasn't like today where everyone learns coding in, you know, elementary schools.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=557.72,625.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/21","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So.. so was there any particular reason why you chose Berkeley?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=628.14,633.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/22","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, when I was a little kid, my parents would take me over to campus and I would play in the Strawberry Creek. You know, Berkeley campus was just sort of part of my life and always had been. And I can't even remember if I even applied to any other schools. It just, it seemed like the obvious thing. There were other practical issues. My mother was still a schoolteacher at that point. And, you know, frankly, we didn't make very much money. And so this way I could live at home, commute into campus. And so combination of good school, familiar place, money, And I don't know, it just, it's always felt right. That's, you know, fairly obscure, I guess, but, you know, the computer science at Berkeley, computer science department existed, but it wasn't the powerhouse that it is today. So it wasn't like I was going, oh that's the best school in the country for it. It probably is today, but not then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=640.12,714.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/23","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Was there any particular episode that you remember from those years?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=717.34,723.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/24","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Many of them. I was a pretty obnoxious kid back then. You know, dealing with all this emotional stuff going on with me, left me kind of hostile and so forth. I think about it now and wonder how anyone put up with me at all. And in particular, I would be in classes where somebody was teaching programming and if they made even the slightest mistake, I would interrupt the professor and point out his mistake. That did not endear me to people, but it did give me a reputation. And at some point there was a brand new research project called the Ingress Project Interactive Graphics and Retrieval System, which was actually a database management system. It wasn't in the name. And it was one of the first relational databases around. There were two projects in the whole world doing relational databases. One of them was Ingress at Berkeley and the other was System R from IBM and San Jose.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=725.34,803.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/25","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so Mike Stonebreaker, who was the PI, principal investigator on Ingress, You know, I guess actually he was supposed to be my undergrad advisor as well. Anyway, he suggested that I might come up, come in as a part-time Senior Engineering Aid was I think the title, which, you know, I got paid, which seemed like an immense amount of money because I never had any money before then. It was, you know, probably $800 a month or something like that, but it was greater than zero. And so I ended up being dropped into a grad school setting when I was a sophomore and that definitely changed my life that was an amazing experience and I can probably tell stories for hours about that, but I won't bore you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=805.68,876.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/26","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Just tell one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=878.4,879.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/27","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Sorry?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=880.52,881.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/28","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Just tell one, Ben.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=881.38,882.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/29","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Just one. Part of the thing that was interesting about the Ingress project is we were doing some really cutting edge research. It was also pretty laid back. And so people would be, you know, have other side projects that they were doing, and I had a bunch of side projects, some of which I've become quite well known for. And that freedom allowed me to explore a lot of things that I, if I was just, you know, in the standard undergraduate program, I never would have been exposed to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=883.9,936.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/30","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the other thing was the Ingress project was working on Unix, which was, I think, Unix, when I first started, it was Unix version 4. And quickly it went up to 5 version 5 and then version 6 for a long time. But I got to kind of, ride the Unix wave at the same time. And that was also a growth experience and I started going to youth conferences and met a lot of people. So, you know, serendipitous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=938.86,977.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/31","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So, during the years at Berkeley, you worked on Ingress Project, but also in the early 1980s, you designed DeliverMail. Can you tell us about it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=980.94,997.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/32","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. So the Ingress Project at some point got a DARPA grant- Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency, which meant we had a link to the ARPANET. The ARPANET is the network that existed before the internet. And it was a small network, you know, a couple hundred machines on the entire network, couldn't grow any larger than that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=998.74,1028.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/33","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But there was enough going on that everyone in the department wanted an account on our machines so that they could connect to the network. And, um, we didn't have a particularly big machine because, you know, we didn't have a massive brand. So we said, okay, we can free up two RS-232 ports, just a simple text only way to connect to the machine. And since these ports cost, you know, 500 bucks a piece or whatever, it was just..we told other people if you want more you can pay for it yourself, basically. And nobody wanted to pay for it themselves. So there were two ports being shared by the entire department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1030.68,1086.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/34","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And you can imagine this got into some uncomfortable situation. And at that point, I was already sort of the main system administrator for that machine. And so I was, of course, the person they complained to. And usually, of course, they couldn't do anything about it, but they complained to me anyway. And at some point, I made the observation that what most people wanted access to was email.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1090.08,1125.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/35","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Now, it turns out we already had a- another very slow, also terminal-based network called Birknet, which was a project done by a guy named Eric Schmidt, who later became CEO of Google. So I worked with Eric. And it would send mail, but only inside the campus. It wouldn't go out. And similarly, mail from ARPANET wouldn't go to another machine. And so I said, you know, Birknet is software, ARPANET is software, and I know how to write software. I'll bet I can find some way to glue these things together so you can get your email on your home machine, not on your machine. And that was a quick hack called DeliverMail. And I won't say it worked well, but it did work and so I basically wrote Deliver Mail to get people to stop bothering me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1126.5,1199.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/36","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Can you describe Eric Schmidt?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1206.82,1208.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/37","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Eric was driven. You know, I think we all you know all the students kind of knew that Eric was going to be CEO of a big company someday because, you know, he got a dual major in business and computer science. And, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1212.82,1231.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/38","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I got along with Eric, but he could be a pain in the butt sometimes, actually. On the other hand, I could too, so it was only fair. But yeah, he, I mean, I think genuinely he was, he had in his head that he was going to be CEO of a major corporation. He just focused his entire life on that. And he succeeded.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1231.72,1260.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/39","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, let's go back to your life and career. So what about SendMail?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1262.9,1270.009"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/40","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, so one of the superstars at Berkeley was a guy named Bill Joy. And, um, Bill Joy at some point did a, uh, distribution.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1272.38,1284.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/41","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So back then it was kind of, suppose you'd call it early days of what we call open source software. It wasn't really because there was open source software back in the 50s. The IBM share conference was called share because it was specifically about, hey, you know, here's a tape of the stuff I've been working on, give me a tape of what you've been working on. So just give us a swap meet. Usenix got to be very much like a swap meet as well. And there were a bunch of people in the area who were actively working on Unix and developing it and whatnot, including Bill and a bunch of others at Berkeley and Tom Farran at the UC San Francisco. And so, I mean, there were some really exciting meetings in Bill's office sometimes where you get all of these, you know, super high powered people hogging the whiteboard. I guess it was actually chalkboards back then. Ken Thompson came out to Berkeley on sabbatical for a year. So","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1286.52,1359.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/42","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you know, I have actually I have here in my desk drawer a listing of the version 6 UNIX kernel hand-annotated because Ken actually gave a free class, evening class, where he walked through the Kernel and taught everyone how it worked. And there were, I think, maybe a dozen people in the room. You know, now if you were to do something like that, of course, you have to fire the Coliseum out. And so it was a very, very exciting environment to be in. And, you know, I think I may have lost track of the question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1360.24,1401.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/43","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e I was asking you about SendMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1403.26,1405.229"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/44","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ah, yes. So Bill did Berkeley software distributions. Can't remember now second, third Berkeley software distribution was getting to be kind of to the form of a whole system and at this point it still required an AT\u0026T License so it wasn't really open source in the way that it is today. But since everyone who was using Unix had to have an AT\u0026T license, it was kind of sort of open source within that community. And so Berkeley, so Bob Fabry, who was a faculty member there, started up the Computer Systems Research Group, CSRG, and hired Bill and a bunch of other people whose names you probably recognize. And they got a grant from DARPA to create the system for the internet, as yet non-existent internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1406.14,1486.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/45","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So we ended up doing the TCP/IP stack at Berkeley, incorporating ideas from other places. I don't want to say we did everything. We were, in fact, very open to picking up other people's work and integrating it. And one of the things that was needed was a mail system. And the mail system for the internet was completely, utterly different than the mail system on the ARPANET. And so at that point, I had done deliver mail. And Bill came to me and said, so Eric, you know more about email than anyone else here. Why don't you do it? At that point, I was working on the Ingress project but you know never wanted to pass up an interesting problem. I agreed to do this and if I had known how hard it was going to be I would never have agreed to it. It was a lot of work. But, you know, I stuck with it. And so when, you know, on the day, literally there was a day when the Internet got turned on, Sendmail was the mail program for the entire Internet. And it snowballed from there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1488.16,1567.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/46","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e During those years you also produced Syslog.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1572.04,1577.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/47","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ah, yes. Syslog, much less exciting I suppose, but arguably more important, was just a way to, for various programs to write to a log file to say what they're doing, which when you're writing programs that you run them and they run and then they stop, you can print stuff out and so forth and that's easy but if you're running writing a program where it runs in the background and you never actually see its output, it has to have some place where you can figure out what's going on when it's not working.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1577.64,1618.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/48","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The usual thing then was you open a file and write to that file. And the file is somewhere. There was no standard for where it should be in the file system. So it would always be a, you know, where do I find the log file for this program? It's around here somewhere. Maybe I'll be in somebody's home directory for all I know. And the other thing was when you have multiple writers that, and you're writing to a log file, they interact with each other and you can get alphabet soup. So I wanted a system where you could send a message to a demon that would look at the message and then take a configuration file and tell it where that message should be logged. And it could be multiple places. And that syslog is still in use. It's been rewritten since then, but it's still fundamentally the same thing. It's actually, it's an internet standard now. And so maybe not the most exciting thing I've ever done, but possibly the most important or impactful let me say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1619.28,1699.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/49","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What about dash MI macros?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1703.08,1707.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/50","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ah, the ME macros.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1708.68,1710.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/51","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e ME macros, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1710.78,1712.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/52","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, yeah, there was, Unix had some programs for doing text formatting. And there was one early on called Rof, which was very simple. And then another one came along called NROF, which was the new Rof. Rof stood for runoff. So it was the new runoff program. And then there was another system that came out compatible with NROF later called TROF, which actually went to a photo typesetting. But the thing about NROF and TROF is they were almost unusable without a macro package because it was a brilliant design that gave you just the very barest tools you needed to essentially implement your own language. And Berkeley had nRoth and I think actually had tRoth but it did not have a macro package. AT\u0026T wouldn't release that. And so I decided I was going to build one because I really wanted to use NROF. And so I ended up doing the ME macros and learned a lot about NROFand TROF and typesetting. And, you know, I still have my, you know, PICA ruler here and so forth from when I was measuring stuff out. And yeah, it got used a lot at Berkeley and did get distributed. You can still find it on pretty much any Unix distribution, but mostly people use other tools today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1712.74,1825.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/53","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, you know, it was cool though. I think the best thing about it was, so back then when students were getting their PhDs, they had to get it typed up or, you know, we're starting to get to the point where it's typeset. And it goes to the something graduate office. And there's a woman there who like pulls out a ruler and makes sure all of the margins are exactly right and so forth. And if they're not, she says, go away, come back when you get it right. She was called the Dragon Lady. And so I added in a macro called .th for thesis, and that just set all the settings right so it would get past the dragon lady. And that made me a very popular guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1826.06,1879.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/54","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And you also wrote Trek, the Unix version of Star Trek video game.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1883.4,1889.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/55","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes. It's not the first Trek version, although I did make some enhancements. There was one written in, I think it was Fortran, that somehow I came across. I think I must have played it somewhere at one point and said this is pretty cool but it should run on the computer that I actually have access to and so I started working on writing track wasn't quite a port of the old one because I did start pretty much over from scratch and that went on. You know, I mentioned the kind of relaxed environment at the Ingress project. It was relaxed enough that at some point I got involved in Trek during a summer, and during the summer I was paid for full-time instead of part-time, and I spent basically all of my full-time work working on Trek instead of on Ingress, which they should never have let me get away with, but it was fun. And there's an interesting story about Trek.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1890.98,1958.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/56","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e People were a lot more casual about privacy issues back then and Ken Thompson had root super user access to every Unix machine on campus. And it turns out that before he went back to Bell labs, he made a tape of the entire system, including all everyone's personal files and so forth and took it with him. And so one day I'm working in my office at Ingress. At that point I was, I had a private office because I was the guy who did frontline support and can't remember what my title was, but I rated a private office and I got this phone call. And guy comes and says, Hi, I've looked at your Trek program and it looks like it's not finished yet. Did you abandon it? And I went, no, I did not abandon it. I didn't even know you had it. Said, oh, well, Ken brought it back from Berkeley. So I was in the middle of developing it. Anyway, He and I started communicating and sharing ideas and so forth. That guy was named Steve Dorn, who is known for the Bourne shell and several other things. So I'm still in contact with Steve. Yeah, he always called me because it was a long-distance call to New Jersey and since he worked for the phone company he got free calls and we had very expensive calls. So that was the arrangement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1961.98,2074.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/57","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e In 1981, you had a summer job at the International Institute for Applied Systems Analysis in Luxembourg, Austria, Europe as a consultant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2079.34,2094.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/58","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Can you tell us more about this experience? How did you get this job? And what was your impression of Europe in the early 80s?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2095.76,2105.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/59","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So there was a guy who was a scientist mostly working on energy related matters. Back before energy was a trendy thing to work on. And he had done stints at IASA, International Institute for Applied Systems Analysis, aka YASA. And there was a guy at YASA who was trying to build a graphic system that the scientists could use. And this is in the very early days of graphic interfaces, uh certainly wasn't you know you go down to the corner store and buy yourself a Mac or anything like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2110.28,2158.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/60","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So he had collected together all of this hardware and stuff to build it, but they had never gotten it working. And so somehow my friend Jerry was able to get me an invitation to come to do a summer at YASA that took time off from Berkeley and went to build this thing called feds the front-end system, zystem I guess I don't know and I quickly found out why this thing had never gotten working because every time I'd, you know, move forward, the YASA guy would come and say, oh, well, you know, you should put this in, it should add this and so forth. So","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2159.16,2210.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/61","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was always like trying to do more and I was just trying to get it to work. And so he and I ended up, I guess, not really getting along all that well, because I said no. And I said, you know, I'm going to get this to work. And by God, at the end of the summer, it worked. It didn't work well, it didn't work fancy, it wasn't user-friendly, It wasn't something that the scientists could actually use, but it did work. And the other thing that was interesting about that job was, it was, the Institute itself was in a palace, one of Maria Theresa's summer palaces. And my office had been friends of Joseph's library and big, huge glass doors all around the outside of the building so I could just walk through that door and I'd be in a I think it was 40 hectare park and wander around if I wanted to stop and think about something. And there was a castle in the middle of the park that was built for Marie Antoinette as a dollhouse, but, you know, life-sized dollhouse. She could walk into it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2210.2,2293.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/62","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And another interesting thing about YASA was it was, I think at that time, the only scientific institute in the world that had people both from the Soviet Union and from Western governments. So I got to know some of the Soviets there and learned that a lot of the stuff I'd been taught in school maybe not have been completely accurate. Like these were people who, one guy was very concerned because his wife had to go to the hospital and she wasn't with him, she was back in Soviet Union. And just the outpouring of, you know, I can't really say love, but concern for him, made it very clear to me that most people in Russia just want to live their lives kind of like we do and that was a good thing for me to learn. And there was a Polish guy who was involved with the, what was the union, solidarity. I actually have a solidarity union pin around here somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2297.1,2373.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/63","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And we had United Nations access, so I had access to the UN commissary, and everything was tax free, and all over the world, and so forth. It was just a splendid summer, I have to say. It was also my first time in Europe, and so it's been kind of disappointing ever since to not be in something quite that exciting, but I love Europe anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2374.94,2398.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/64","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Did you travel around Europe when you were there? That's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2400.24,2405.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/65","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e No, I did not. I certainly have traveled a fair amount since, but at that point, I remember I was taking leave from work and so forth. So I kind of had to get back. And I was in a relationship then. In fact, the relationship I'm still in. And so I wanted to get back home and be able to cuddle with my honey.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2407.94,2437.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/66","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So you were back home and in November 1981, you joined Britton Lee, Pioneering Relational Database Company. So I have the feeling that some of your colleagues at Berkeley invited you there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2440.52,2464.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/67","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Very true. Yes, Britton Lee was a Ingress spin-off, kind of an interesting, maybe a little schizophrenic company. The people who founded it were hardware guys and so they wanted to build a special-purpose computer that would run database applications. And they didn't realize that the secret sauce in the database system is not the hardware, it's the software. So there was a software group in Berkeley, even though most of the company was in Los Gatos. And I got hired in initially to manage the, what was called the host software group, which is to say the things that run on your computers that talk to the database computer, we call it a database machine. Then it was really one of the first cases of client-server, so it was really a database server, but that's not what the word was back then. And so all of the user interfaces that people would use, which was mostly programmatic interfaces. And I kind of got a group together And one of the best hires I've ever made, in fact, was a guy named Greg Olson, who I'll talk about later some more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2465.08,2561.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/68","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, we were doing some good work, But I was having, this was my first management job and I did not particularly like management jobs. So at some point I went to my boss and I said, I wanna go back to being an engineer, way better at it than I am being a manager. And you know I'd like to do it here and work on this stuff but you know if you can't do that I'll find another job. And to his credit, he didn't say, well, bye, see you later. He, in fact, did put me down to being a wine engineer again. And by the way, did not cut my salary amazingly. And but the flip side is he took this guy, Greg Olson, who was my best engineer and made him my boss. And I've always wondered if he wasn't doing that in the hopes that I would find that such an insult that I would quit. Um, but in fact, Greg was the perfect boss. I mean, like day one, he came in and said, Eric, you're a way better programmer than I'll ever be. So how about, you know, we kind of do this together and you manage the technology and I'll manage management. And it worked great. Really worked well. I ended up doing a system there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2562.62,2657.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/69","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Um, basically I came to the conclusion that it was too hard to build database applications and there was no reason the database application had to be really difficult. So I built a system called ADIT, Advanced Database Interface Tools, that included a graphic component so that you could actually do stuff that you couldn't do on the Fez system back in Austria. But I got it to the point where it was prototyped. Still needed a lot of work. But it was getting to the point where it became clear that we were going to need marketing support. And so we did a big all day demo. VP of marketing came up to Berkeley, we gave him, you know, this big tour, showed him all the stuff it could do. And at the end of the day, he said, you know, you engineers always, you just have your heads in the clouds. People don't want these. You're using Sun workstations, which are kind of expensive at the time, I suppose. People don't want workstations. They're way too expensive. They want PC applications. They want text-only PC applications, because graphics wasn't big on the PC. And after I picked my job off the floor, best I could come up with is they will be asking for it. But he was like, no, no marketing resources are going to go to this at all. And that's when I realized I had to shut down the project, which I did over, you know, sort of cleaned it all up, documented it in the hopes that somebody would come along and revise it when they finally figured out what was important. This is part of the thing where Britton Lee was a hardware company, not a software company. What I was doing was software and hence not valuable. And I ended up meeting up with a friend of mine who had been a grad student when I was at Berkeley, and he was working at a new place called the International Computer Science Institute, ICSI. And so I jumped from Britton Lee to ICSI, which was an easy jump to do because they were a block apart in Berkeley. Didn't have to rent a truck or anything. And am I getting too far ahead here?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2658.92,2817.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/70","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e That's perfect. Yeah, yeah, no. So that was in 88 when you joined the speech group at the International Computer Science Institute, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2818.0,2828.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/71","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Sounds about right. I have to look at my resume. I'm not very good on remembering dates.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2828.76,2833.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/72","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, Morgan, who was known then just as Morgan, his full name was actually Nelson Morgan, had been working on digital audio as a grad student in electrical engineering. And he got his PhD and he went to ICSE. He developed an interest in speech recognition and so he started up a group which was called the Realization Group. There were a bunch of little groups inside of ICSE. It was funded by the German government, although it was associated with Berkeley, so we had access to Berkeley networks and things, but we didn't get a Berkeley paycheck. And I had what is undoubtedly the most spectacular office I have ever had in my career. It was huge. You could probably play basketball in it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2836.18,2892.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/73","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Nice job. But So the point of ICSI, Jerry Feldman, who was the director of the Institute, was a lot on these things called neural networks. And neural networks had been a thing back in the 60s and then had kind of fallen out of favor. And he wanted to make this institute working on what, neural networks, which were kind of a form of artificial intelligence. Now we call them deep learning and it's the big rage right now. But back then hardware was limited And so I was in a group that was part hardware, part software. And the hardware folks built a thing called the ring array processor, which was a unusual architecture because the communication paths could only go to the left or to the right but couldn't go to an arbitrary another node so a whole bunch of computers in a box and it turns out that was a great architecture for doing neural networks and I was writing software for it and I actually didn't stay too long at ICSI because it turns out that my job was, let's look at, you know, eight lines of assembly language and see if we can get that down to seven lines of assembly language. And if that takes a month, so be it. And, you know, it was interesting. I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2897.86,3002.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/74","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e learned a lot about learning algorithms and things like that. I still have, you know, books on my shelf from back then. So, and I get to say, I actually did the deep learning stuff back before it was popular, but didn't really spend a lot of time at it. Nonetheless, it was fun doing something new. It's been a theme through my career. Some people say, okay, I'm going to work on this, and they figure that out in grad school and they spend their entire career working on that and I'm the sort of person who every five years or so gets bored and says I want to do something completely different And that was completely different.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3002.58,3044.743"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/75","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So in 1989 you moved back to the University of California Berkeley as the lead programmer on the Mammoth project.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3047.14,3055.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/76","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3057.42,3057.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/77","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What was the Mammoth project?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3062.54,3063.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/78","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So Mammoth was an infrastructure group. At that time, Berkeley was... if you had a project where you were using a computer, and at that point pretty much everyone was on Unix. You had your own computer and your own system administrator, and you managed your own machine, and everyone tended to customize their own software. And it was starting to become a problem because two groups would talk to each other and say \"oh, you know we're doing stuff that would really fit together nicely\" and then discover they couldn't fit them together because they or use different versions of the compiler or something. And so, um, a professor, Susan Graham, um, became the PI on the Mammoth project. And the idea was we got an actually really big grant to install and manage infrastructure. And so we had a CM5 from Thinking Machines, which was a parallel computer at that point, which I don't quite know how they talked thinking machines into letting them have one for a fraction of the price because these things... so there's at the end of the rack there's a panel filled with blinking lights and you've seen it in Jurassic Park because in the scene where the girl goes into the machine room and goes \"Oh, this is Unix. I know how to use this.\" The machine was actually a CM5 and in fact the guy who maintained our machine was the one who installed that on the set. And it turns out there were no processors at all in that box. The lights flashing, there was a separate processor just to blink the lights. It did absolutely nothing. And so they had an empty box. We had a box with a few things in it. And that machine, that panel was so heavy that it took two people to lift it up. It was just, the machine was a disaster in terms of actually being usable and maintainable and so forth. Anyway, that was one of the things. Another one was a compute machine. This is back in the time when people are starting to say maybe this parallel processing stuff is a good idea. And so they got a, oh, come on, it was running RISC-OS. It was a, I can't remember the manufacturer now, but I think it was the 32 processor system, which was about the biggest you could get back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3065.74,3258.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/79","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the third one was a disk server, which we got from another company. And the idea was people could get time, counts, whatever, on any of these resources. And that way they wouldn't have to manage the machines themselves. So on the disk servers we built something called the software warehouse, which basically said, let's find all the interesting software that anyone might wanna use, we'll put it in one place, it'll be shared through the whole department, we will maintain it. And so all of these people who have been spending all their time doing system administration can actually do real research. And it was incredibly successful. And at a group there, at that point, I was a manager again, but I was getting to be better at it And I had been in my first management job and yeah, it was kind of changed the whole culture in the department. So I was a very popular guy in the department for a while. But the problem with the mammoth project is it had gotten to the point where it was starting to become a, okay, just keep things running. And so it was a maintenance job. And I was, like I said, every five years I get itchy. And so I got itchy and decided to leave.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3260.9,3365.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/80","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was 1995.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3366.28,3367.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/81","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3371.64,3372.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/82","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e You joined in reference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3372.56,3374.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/83","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, well, there's twice in my life where I've taken jobs that were really a mistake. And I think that was one of them. It looked kind of cool. But first of all, it was in Sunnyvale, so I had to commute from Berkeley, which was, I don't like to drive, and so that was terrible. But the other thing was, the guy who founded it turns out didn't seem to know what the product was that he was trying to build. And so every time I was the chief technology officer and at that point I had kind of a name so he always wanted to strut me out to show people that we had this techie guy on his staff and I learned to keep my mouth shut until I found out what the product was today. And then I had to ad lib it. So that was just kind of a disaster. And I ended up leaving that. It ended up getting sold off to another place which was an internet ad company. So in reference turned into an internet ad company but that was after I left. Trust me I wouldn't do that to you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3376.32,3463.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/84","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what happened when you left in reference?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3465.72,3468.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/85","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, that was a painful experience, both between the commute and the uncertainty of the job and so forth. So I realized I had enough money in the bank that I could probably survive for six months without too much trouble. And so I was basically acting as a consultant and I was working on I wrote, co-authored a book on send mail. That was during that time I did some other well, I did other consulting a big one there being a company that wanted to do mass mailing, which, you know, now everyone has this, but back then it was a new thing. Anyway, I was here in Berkeley, down at Pete's, which is two blocks from my house getting coffee. And who did I run into but Greg Olson, same guy I'd worked with at Britton Lee. And you know, I'd had in the back of my head a thing of, well, maybe I could get some companies together and create a consortium that, you know, they'd each give me a small amount of money to develop and maintain Sendmail. I could hire somebody to do the frontline support, which was taking up more and more of my time. You know, free email consulting. I was spending half my day every day just answering mail, most of which was, see this page. It's documented, look it up. So I had gone to some couple other places and the general attitude seemed to be, yeah, we would fund you for that as long as we own it. And I'm like,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3470.14,3599.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/86","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e no, that's not the point. Point is, if ownership is spread out and nobody would go for that and so Greg at that point had gone stayed on the management route and he had been you know VP of marketing, and VP of engineering and VP of sales and so forth. So you had all of these, this background and how companies actually work. And I told him about this and he said, you know, I'm between jobs right now and I'm kind of doing business consulting and I'll help you write a business plan. You could do a company, you know, just a standalone company. And so we spent that summer working on a business plan. And when the whole thing came together, I basically said, I'll give you half the company if you'd be my CEO. And so he did that and was a really great CEO. And yeah, it was pretty heady. We made the front page of the New York Times when we announced the company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3599.06,3675.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/87","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So that was in March 1998.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3677.94,3680.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/88","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, that's right. It was. I was thinking it was earlier, but no, that's right. So you know, we, SendMail had a reputation for being difficult to configure so our first thing was we'll make it easy to configure and using a graphic user interface and so forth. And, well, I could go through the whole history of SendMail, but probably it's only of interest to three people in the world. So, if there's anything in particular you're interested in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3686.28,3725.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/89","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e The evolution of the company, when you founded it, and what happened eventually. And what were the key events?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3727.82,3738.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/90","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I was Chief Technology Officer. I was acting as VP of engineering at first but we had to get another VP of engineering because two things actually one was part of VP of engineering is doing budgets and things like that which was not something that really got me excited. But the other thing was, and this is probably a mistake I made at Sendmail, the marketing department at that point, I really had a reputation. So the marketing department wanted to, you know, bring me out to speak in front of customers and stuff, you know, at conferences, etc. So, I ended up flying all over the world, meeting customers. There was one time when I had been in Europe for, you know, probably four or five different countries in Europe, had to fly back to Berkeley for some meeting or event, and the very next day flew to Japan. So it was kind of grueling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3745.08,3821.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/91","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I ended up doing more marketing actually than technology, which kind of bummed me out. We did get some important things done here. We came up with the Miltur interface, stood for mail filter. And that was a way to do plugins into SendMail to do mail filtering, which can be arbitrary, but of course the big thing back then was anti-spam. Spam was becoming a really serious problem. The milter interface was very successful to the extent that other MTAs that are out there are compatible with the SendMail milters. And I worked on some standards for the IETF, the Internet Engineering Task Force, which sets the standards for the Internet. In particular one called DKIM, Domain Keys Identified Mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3828.62,3886.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/92","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I... The standards process is an interesting one. And I ended up, I did that and then decided I didn't wanna do standards anymore just because it was tedious. And there were some people there who were very, very difficult to work with, and you couldn't get rid of them. So that was the end of my standards career. And then, this is gonna sound a little bizarre, but one of my lucky breaks was I was diagnosed with prostate cancer. And I know you don't think of that as a lucky break, but I was 51, 52, I think then. And so I decided I would have surgery. And there was, of course, a recovery period from surgery. And so I ended up taking some time off and eventually went to part time. And that got me a little bit away and you know, I continued working there for a while but realized that I'd come in once a week and say hi to people but that was not all I was doing and I don't like doing jobs which are nothing, you know, getting paid to do nothing. Didn't sit well with me. So","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3889.56,3985.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/93","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e at that some point I left Sendmail, which was right about the time it was acquired by Proofpoint. And things worked out pretty well actually. The customers, all the products continued to be supported. The employees, except for upper management, kept their jobs. And, you know, it was, you know, I'm kind of sorry that Sendmail didn't turn into a big star, but it wasn't adequate result. Unfortunately, the investors, myself included, didn't do very well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3986.34,4027.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/94","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what did you do when you left SendMail?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4035.82,4038.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/95","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, that was the second time I made a kind of job mistake. I went to work at a company in San Francisco, which perhaps I shouldn't name, but doing streaming database queries. So taking SQL and instead of having it say, here's the data, you know, tell me what the average salary is, it would watch the data as it came through, computing things and picking out other things, which was actually an interesting idea. It's actually a pretty good idea. But it was, the coding was all in C++, a language that I despise, and Java, a language which I didn't really know. And the management at that company was very, very proud of the fact that they had a million lines of source code. And they're like, ooh, we're gonna tell everyone how much source code we have. And the engineers are all going, no, don't do it. We have a million lines of source code because we couldn't figure out how to make it smaller. And so that was a very demoralizing. I think I did one, you know, made one innovation where I discovered an N squared algorithm in the thing, but which was, you know, that's a big deal. But I felt like I wasn't succeeding very well. And I was thinking, you know, maybe after all that time at Sendmail where I basically wasn't writing any code anymore and maybe I just couldn't do it anymore. So I ended up putting my tail between my legs and gave that one up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4041.28,4153.779"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/96","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e In 2011 you kind of retired. So what did you do?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4155.939,4161.359"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/97","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, yeah, I I did actually try to retire I.. you know did some but I was basically saying okay, you know at this point I've got enough money in the bank. You know, Sendmail was paying me pretty well, but I live a pretty frugal lifestyle. So I had actually amassed a nice nest egg. And so back in my mammoth days, one of the things that happened was the computer science department moved into a new building and so all of those computers and things that I was talking about had to move from the old building into the new building and the new building had to have a whole new network and so forth. And I worked with another staff member, a guy named Ken Lutz, who as near as I can tell has worked on every interesting project that Berkeley has ever done in computer science. He's, you know, did RAID and network abort stations and all these really cool projects. So I ran into him, actually, no, I didn't run into him. He called me, I guess, and said, you know, Eric, I'm working at a new research lab called the Swarm Lab at Berkeley. And there's some stuff going on here I think you might find interesting. And we have seminars at lunchtime on Thursdays, free lunch. Why don't you come up and see what we're doing?\" I went, well sure, okay, free lunch, got me. And so I went up and indeed it was very interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4162.359,4273.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/98","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Now this was the first time I've been in a lab which looked like a lab. This is where they have oscilloscopes and signal generators and microscopes and heavy duty chemicals and so forth. And I was a software guy. But it was still really interesting stuff. And so I ended up hanging out at a research project and at some point was hanging out enough that they ended up hiring me. So I went back to work, working for the university. And so that I believe will be the last job of my career unless something changes. So I bracketed my career with university jobs, which, you know, I'm not unhappy about that. And I do have to say like I said after I finished with the previous company I was really kind of demoralized, convinced that I just couldn't program anymore. And I ended up writing most of the code for that research project and kind of got my mojo back. So it was a good job and I loved working with him. He was absolutely fabulous guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4273.24,4356.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/99","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So during your career, you received many honors and in particular, In 2014, you were inducted to the Internet Hall of Fame.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4359.78,4371.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4373.24,4373.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Did you expect that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4374.24,4375.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Did I expect that? Not at all. Yeah, I don't quite remember how it even came about but yeah, I flew to Hong Kong for that ceremony and you know, they they made a big deal out of it. And they end up having a whole bunch of really interesting people. It turns out I already personally knew some of the inductees, including Paul Bixey, who was inducted the same time I was. So he and I ran around Hong Kong together. That was pretty cool. And yeah, you know, it was obviously for internet mail. And they had some clever way of making it sound more important than it actually was. But there you go.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4376.74,4440.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e You have been involved in Usenix since the 70s, 1970s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4447.06,4452.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4454.2,4454.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What have been your roles in the years?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4455.04,4458.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, so I started just attending USENIX. The first USENIX I went to was in San Francisco. And Tom Ferron, who I mentioned earlier, was chairing that conference. And it was an amazingly wonderful conference. It's like you know I'm with my people here This is great and so I started going to more conferences and eventually I ended up on the board of directors and did that for several years and several different roles I think I was Vice President at one point and Treasurer another point. But there are term limits on the using sport, which is a good thing. I believe in term limits and so I'm still however on the audit committee. So every year we get together and go through the audits of the finances to make sure there's no hanky-panky going on. So I'm still connected with these things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4460.86,4533.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So you publish several papers, books, articles. What is the publication you are most proud of?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4536.28,4547.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I don't know that I would say pride exactly. You know some of them have been important. There's been you know papers that came out with important. There's been papers that came out associated with Ingress that have made an impact. I was on the editorial review board of, not unit review, that's a different one, of ACM Q Magazine. And as a result of being on that board, wrote a lot of articles for Q, which was designed more for practitioners. So it wasn't, you know, hardcore bits and bytes. And one of those, managing technical debt, turns out to now be probably my most referenced paper ever. People are referencing it all over the place. You know, I think it's a good paper, you know, article, really, not a paper. But I don't quite understand why that's more important than some of the other ones I've done.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4550.38,4620.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, obviously, the Sendmail book was a big deal at the time. It was a... O'Reilly and Associates said it was their best-selling book for several years. So Brian Costales was the primary author on that, so I can't really take the credit for that one. I don't know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4622.26,4649.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I mean, I try and do, I try and feel at least not embarrassed by anything I publish. So I don't know if that means proud. I guess it's more important what has actually had impact and Those two things are probably the ones that have had the most impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4651.0,4673.681"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what activities have you pursued recently?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4675.44,4679.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, well I retired from the university in and you know really retired from the university this time as in, you know, I'm getting a pension. And so, you know, I still do technology work and so forth. I'm a wine collector. And so I built a database to store the inventory of our wine cellar. And that's all in Python, which was a language I had to learn in order to do this. And I'm kind of the default system administrator for the house, which I kind of hate, but somebody has to do it. I got involved in a place called the Hillside, Berkeley Hillside Club, several years ago, originally just as a member. Hillside Club is a member organization focusing on basically art, architecture, you know, certain current event things, climate change, et cetera. And at some point ended up, I didn't get out of the way fast enough and I ended up being elected to the board. And I just literally a few days ago, turned out and I ultimately ended up as President. And I'm this President for two years and I'm gratified that many people have told me that I was actually a good President. So I almost feel like now that I've retired, I may have gotten this management thing working. And actually after swearing I would never start another company again in my life. I started another company called the, it's a not-for-profit called the Berkeley Historic Building Fund. And it's to collect money to maintain historic buildings, including the building that the Hillside Club is in. So we are interested in getting a new roof and things like that. So I'm kind of doing, you know, more social things now, not so much serious tech.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4681.98,4834.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, let's go back to many years ago. So In 1976, you came out of the closet. You already mentioned your partner. But what I wanted to ask you is, what happened in 1976? How you did it and what was its impact in those days, in the mid-70s?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4837.42,4862.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was in an emotionally very, very bad way. I won't go into the gory details, but it became very clear to me that I had to come out and I didn't even want to consider the alternative. And that was probably the best decision I've ever made in my life. You know, I lost some friends. You know, when I came out of the closet, I didn't just like open the door, I used dynamite to blow it open. And I was working on the Ingress Project back then. And there were some people who were clearly concerned about that. But a whole bunch of the other people were like, yay for you. And some of those people remained some of my best friends. But more importantly, I think I mentioned kind of an angry personality for a while. You know, some of that was, you know, frankly, I got some of it from my father, but a lot of it was just pent up, you know, self-hatred, I guess. And that let me open up. And, You know, like I said, there were people who, you know, I lost, but it gave me a path to being an easier to get along with person. And so I think it, you know, completely changed my personality. I'm much less of an asshole than I was before. And, you know, I did at some point meet a guy who was actually a student at Berkeley. I was still on the Ingress project, but I was out at that point and at the time he was in the closet and so it didn't go well and for a couple of years if we saw each other in the hallway, we'd both turn around and walk the other direction. But then went to a gay students union meeting once, which I almost never did, but I did that day and who would be in the room but the same guy, tried to hide behind a pillow. And we've been together ever since, 44 years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4868.08,5040.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So in 1998, you said in an interview, there is some sort of perverse pleasure in knowing that it's basically impossible to send a piece of hate mail out through the internet without...(voice gets cut)","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5042.26,5059.085"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, that was a period where there was a lot of sort of Christian fundamentalism that somehow was sneaking into the technology world. Somebody was proposing a new version of Unix called Yazix, I think. And you know, there would be no kill command because you know to kill as a sin so they renamed that and they obviously they had to get rid of some mail because it was written by what do they say a well-known gay activist or something like that. I don't remember exactly what it was. And I can't even remember when or where I said that or to whom, But it was just kind of an offhanded, you know, aside. And Sendmail survived and Yazix or whatever they were calling it didn't. So I win.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5063.6,5130.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Would you like to say anything else about your husband?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5136.36,5139.875"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Sure, Kirk McKusick, another kind of luminary. I know you've interviewed him. He shared an office with Bill Joy, so I knew Bill pretty well. He's one of those people he Actually what he it's PhD was in table driven register allocation for compilers, something like that. Something that he has used, I think, once in his career. Although it turns out that his PhD thesis is now referenced by a bunch of people because as computers get to the point where they have more and more registers, the algorithms that he came up with are completely the right things, but that's not what he's working on He started working on the file system for Unix. Once again, Bill Joy saying \"hey Kirk, you know, why don't you work on this?\" and Bill was really good at getting other people to do things. And he wrote what was called at the time the FAST file system. It's now been renamed UFS, the Unix file system, because it's essentially the default Unix file system for everyone.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5143.02,5227.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But he's kept on it. And he has added all kinds of stuff, Background FSCK, for example, so you didn't have to wait forever for the system to reboot. And snapshots, so you could get a backup of a clean file system that wasn't changing out from under you and and and and and and. He's done recently a bunch of work for Netflix, kind of counterintuitive. Netflix uses this file system to distribute the actual movies that are on the internet. And the discs that they use, every day they rewrite them in the middle of the night predicting what is going to be valuable the next day and so if a disc dies we have as many discs as Netflix does there's always a dead disc They didn't want the whole system to crash. They just wanted the system to say, oh, that disk went away, okay, I'll just skip over that. And so they actually paid him to do that work on the condition that it go into the open source. So the whole world benefits from that. So yeah, he's still working on file systems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5230.52,5319.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Have you ever worked together or collaborated on a project?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5321.72,5325.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, many of them. Well, I kind of worked on Trek with Steve, Steve Warren. The ADIT project had multiple programmers on it. There was one guy in particular, uh, who, uh, kind of, we did kind of co-coding for big chunks of it. So we'd actually go into the office at night when we wouldn't get interrupted and spend all night, you know, two computers in the office and working on the code, handing stuff back and forth. Yeah, there's been lots of people who I've done some kind of work with. That experience with the, with, um, at Britain Lee was probably the tightest I've ever worked with anyone before. Others have been, you know, the surgical team model where there's, you know, one guy in charge and other people who are scattered around the side.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5331.54,5412.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Husband?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5417.32,5417.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e With Kirk? One thing about a successful relationship is it may be important to not work too intimately on projects. There's a lot of stuff we've done together, you know, carpentry around the house and so forth. But it's like cooking together. We learned a long time ago that we can cook together as long as we know who's making dinner and who's helping. And it trades off which is which. Doesn't really matter, it's not like one of us has to be in control all the time, but if we try and negotiate everything, it can be a problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5419.94,5461.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Bigly I agree with you. So, what is your main motivation in supporting free and open source software?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5462.86,5474.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, if I'm going to be gallant, I'll make some comment about making the world a better place, etc., etc. If I'm going to be a little more honest, I think it's just because I really love it when people use the stuff I've written. And the easiest way to do that is to give it away. So I have, my whole career, I have not gone for the jobs that make the most money. I've gone to the jobs that most interest me, you know, and assumed that the money would sort of follow along. And, you know, I could be way, way richer than I am right now. But why? I've got enough money that I can retire comfortably, and I can't buy islands or fly private jets or anything like that. But I'm happy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5481.04,5536.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so, yeah, just having people use the work. You know, I love it when somebody comes up and says, oh, I use, you know, whatever, Sendmail, whatever, and you know, I loved it. That just makes me all warm inside.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5537.6,5556.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So if you look at your life, what is the thing you're the most proud of?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5558.4,5564.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Most proud of in my life, it's, I'm tempted to say coming out of the closet because it made my life a lot better and frankly the lives of other people around me a lot better. SendMail obviously had an incredible impact. SendMail is still out there on the internet but it's nowhere near the market share that it used to have. That's okay. Syslog turned out to be really, really important. And once again, it's been rewritten. It's not my code anymore, but it was my idea. You know, the environment at the computer science department at Berkeley, where I had something to do with building it, I'm really proud of. It really improved the ability for researchers to get their jobs done across the entire department. It wasn't just my group, it was the whole department. And that's really pretty cool. You know, the honors and stuff don't mean that much to me. You know, I mean, it's nice to be recognized, but it's not like I, you know, have plaques all around my office, you know, showing off the awards that I've gotten. I think that's tacky.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5572.7,5658.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What advice would you give to someone willing to pursue a career today?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5664.56,5669.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, it depends on what your goals in life are, I guess. Like it's said, I've done the bit of going on and doing whole bunches of different things, which means I've learned a lot, means I'm probably never the best at anything at any given time because I'm the one who's learning about it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5676.54,5700.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But there's a famous guy, won the Turing Award, Jim Gray, who sadly was lost at sea several years ago. And Jim was a friend of mine. And his thing was doing massive databases. And he would pick something that had never been done before and then do it. And these things were earth changing, in some senses quite literally. Maps, the database technology that we have to store maps that you use from everyone today was developed by Jim. And the thing about Jim was he, when he went into a new thing, he didn't just say, okay, what's the, what do I as a computer scientist need to know? He said he wants to understand the technology or the science that is applied. So his last project was working on the sky map, said, you know, well, what's bigger than the whole planet? Oh, how about the whole universe? And when he was honored after he passed away, somebody on that project said, Jim came in and he said, I want to learn about astronomy, not what's your data problem. He said, I want to understand astronomy. And he started actually making serious contributions to the project. I think that's great. And if you can do it, that's wonderful. But I remember chatting with him at some point, and he was working at Microsoft, and he said, they're paying me an obscene amount of money for work that I would happily do for free if they just gave me the resources to do it with. This was a perfect life and so if you can get the perfect life, go for it. You know other people like Kirk are very happy to you know kind of carve out this area and you know if you carve out an area don't make it too small don't make it too big. So, yeah, I would definitely say you know followed the interest don't follow the money obviously, we need enough to be able to put food in the refrigerator and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5701.3,5861.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I think a lot of people going into deep learning AI today are doing it because they think there's, data scientists are going to make a huge amount of money. And that's true, some of them will, but there's so many people going into it right now that there will be a glut of data scientists in a few years. And I did neural networks when neural networks were out of favor. And I kind of like doing stuff that is not popular and having it become popular later. The database interfaces, graphical database interfaces that I mentioned earlier, you know, three years later that's what everyone wanted. And that VP of marketing was an idiot. So, do something exciting, do something that's challenging, and enjoy it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5864.76,5932.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Is there anything you would like to add that you haven't covered today? Probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5936.04,5940.317"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e tons of things. But I was thinking of something earlier, but I've lost it. So I'm just going to say no.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5940.317,5957.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay. We can cover this in another interview, perhaps?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5958.64,5963.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Maybe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5964.56,5965.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, so thank you. It's been a real pleasure talking to you today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5968.18,5974.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, it's been a pleasure talking with you too. It's kind of fun to reminisce.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5975.02,5978.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49301/annotation/139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Thank you very much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5985.94,5986.17"}]},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["TheirStory Transcript (Captions with Speakers) [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Welcome to FOSSDA, the Free and\nOpen Source Stories Digital","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5.22,9.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Archive Foundation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=9.14,10.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e It's the 6th of June, 2023, and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=11.92,14.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e am Elisabetta Mori, a historian of\ncomputing currently based in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=14.86,18.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Italy, and an oral history\ninterviewer with FOSSDA.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=18.92,23.241"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Today, I'll be talking to software\nengineer, Eric Allman, author of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=24.48,28.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e the mail transfer agent, Sendmail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=28.74,30.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e We are recording on TheirStory.io,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=31.98,33.978"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e and I am in Rio, in Elba, in Elba\nIsland, Italy, and Eric is in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=34.84,41.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Berkeley, California.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=41.04,42.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Welcome, Eric.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=43.48,44.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=45.54,45.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Thank you for being here today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=45.56,48.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Where and when were you born?\nI was born in Oakland, which is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=50.6,58.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the next town over from Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=58.26,59.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And back in 1955, which I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=63.38,67.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e sometimes wonder how old I'm\ngetting to be now, and moved when","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=67.48,75.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was about two and a half, three\nmaybe, to El Cerrito, which is a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=75.38,80.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e town on the other side of\nBerkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=80.02,81.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And then at some point I moved\ninto Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=82.0,85.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I've been, I think of myself as\na Berkeley boy through.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=85.16,88.29"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Hello?\nYes, hi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=88.29,103.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We had a glitch there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=103.58,105.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=105.54,106.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So, can you describe your parents?\nSure, my mother was a basically","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=107.02,119.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e spent her life in education.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=119.5,120.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e She was a school teacher","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=121.22,124.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e originally in the Head Start\nprogram and later became a regular","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=125.02,133.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e classroom teacher and at some\npoint got her master's degree and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=133.26,138.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e moved up to the principal role,\nwhich she did for the rest of her","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=139.14,142.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=142.44,142.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e My father was, when I was born,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=145.64,148.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was an adman for the Richmond\nIndependent, which was a local","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=148.08,153.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e paper, long gone now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=153.46,155.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at some point he and my mother","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=158.76,161.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e divorced, and so I'm not as\ncompletely clear about what he was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=161.28,167.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e doing after that, but he stayed in\nadvertising for a while and wrote","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=167.04,172.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e a newspaper column called Art Who,\nwhich was an art critic column,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=172.8,183.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and at some point kind of retired\nand was at that point just sort of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=183.64,190.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e an art collector.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=190.9,192.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, we did art brokering for a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=192.44,194.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e while too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=194.26,195.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And my mother passed away a couple","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=200.08,202.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e years ago, and my father, actually\nmy mother passed away about five","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=202.58,208.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e years ago, and my father passed\naway about two years ago, maybe","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=208.08,213.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e three.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=213.28,213.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm sorry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=214.28,215.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What about your siblings?\nI have one sister, Kat, who...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=219.3,226.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e How can I put this?\nMy sister was, you know, if I was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=231.68,235.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the kind of mathematical one in\nthe family, she was the, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=235.32,239.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e humanities person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=239.16,240.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And she had, I think, a difficult","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=241.74,247.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e time because I was considered to\nbe the great student and she","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=247.58,253.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e always felt like she was in my\nshadow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=253.74,255.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And what's happened is, in fact,\nshe ended up going to work at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=255.7,259.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Google very early on doing open\nsource developer relations and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=259.8,271.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e don't know I think she was there\n15 years, which is pretty amazing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=271.5,276.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and she's recently left and I\nthink she's still contemplating","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=276.82,281.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e whether she wants to retire or you\nknow go for another job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=281.82,285.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What was your family life like?\nMy family life?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=288.68,292.654"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, as I mentioned my parents\ngot divorced when I was quite","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=293.42,297.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e young.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=297.8,298.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I came from what they used","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=299.24,303.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to call back then a broken family,\nalthough I don't think there was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=303.22,307.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e anything particularly broken about\nit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=307.0,308.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e My mother was an absolutely\nwonderful mother who, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=308.88,312.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was at one point going to school,\nhad a full time job and raising","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=312.84,316.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e two kids by herself and never\nseemed to break a sweat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=316.48,322.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was quite astounding.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=322.0,324.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e When she was going to school, my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=327.72,329.772"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e sister and I would sometimes,\nactually most of the time, spend","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=331.08,334.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e summers at my grandparents' 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schools.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=387.98,391.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e They're called middle schools now\nand then I ended up at El Cerrito","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=391.72,394.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e High School which might as I've\nalready intimated my specialties","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=394.78,407.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e seem to be like math and science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=407.38,409.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e No particularly great 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thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=429.32,430.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I did sound, and making sound","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=430.68,435.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e effects was quite 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crash.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=441.2,442.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That was fun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=443.6,444.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e How did you do it?\nI went into the theater when no","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=445.38,449.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e one was around and laid a ladder\non the stage, piled chairs on top","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=449.9,457.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e of the ladder, tied a rope around\nthe ladder and pulled the 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slowed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=464.24,466.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it down or something like that a\nlittle bit and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=466.46,470.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was pretty 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1980.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=492.04,495.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what are your memories of those\nyears?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=497.22,500.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was not a particularly happy kid\nin high 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I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=519.559,524.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was gay, but I was still very much\nin the closet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=524.54,527.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And attitudes then were not as\nforgiving as they are 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the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=643.86,647.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Strawberry Creek.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=647.56,648.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, Berkeley campus was just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=650.74,653.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e sort of part of my life and always\nhad been.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=653.12,655.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I can't even remember if I\neven applied to any other 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point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=668.56,669.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, frankly, we didn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=669.92,672.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e make very much money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=672.4,673.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so this way I could live at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=675.48,676.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e home, commute into campus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=676.96,679.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so combination of good school,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=681.16,686.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e familiar place, money, And I don't\nknow, it just, it's always 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obscure,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=696.94,698.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I guess, but, you know, the\ncomputer science at Berkeley,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=698.56,701.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e computer science department\nexisted, but it wasn't the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=702.38,705.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e powerhouse that it is today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=705.14,706.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So it wasn't like I was going, oh","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=706.78,708.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that's the best school in the\ncountry for it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=708.34,710.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It probably is today, but not\nthen.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=711.76,714.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Was there any particular episode\nthat you remember from those","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=717.34,723.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e years?\nMany of 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I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=756.98,761.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e would interrupt the professor and\npoint out his mistake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=761.52,765.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That did not endear me to people,\nbut it did give me a reputation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=766.14,770.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at some point there was a\nbrand new research project called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=771.82,779.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the Ingress Project Interactive\nGraphics and Retrieval 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relational\ndatabases.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=795.66,797.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e One of them was Ingress at\nBerkeley and the other was System","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=797.72,801.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e R from IBM and San 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Ben.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=881.38,882.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Just one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=883.9,884.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Part of the thing that was\ninteresting about the Ingress","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=895.76,898.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e project is we were doing some\nreally cutting edge research.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=898.3,901.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was also pretty laid 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the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=956.4,959.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Unix wave at the same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=959.16,961.914"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was also a growth","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=963.76,968.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e experience and I started going to\nyouth conferences and met a lot of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=968.2,973.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=973.62,974.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, you know, serendipitous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=975.38,977.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So, during the years at Berkeley,\nyou worked on Ingress Project, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=980.94,990.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e also in the early 1980s, you\ndesigned DeliverMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=990.22,994.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Can you tell us about it?\nYes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=995.58,999.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So the Ingress Project at some\npoint got a DARPA grant- Defense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1000.48,1006.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Advanced Research Projects Agency,\nwhich meant we had a link to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1006.4,1011.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e ARPANET.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1011.62,1012.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The ARPANET is the network that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1012.4,1015.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e existed before the internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1015.08,1016.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it was a small network, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1018.2,1022.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e know, a couple hundred machines on\nthe entire network, couldn't grow","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1022.76,1027.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e any larger than that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1027.44,1028.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But there was enough going on that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1030.68,1033.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e everyone in the department wanted\nan account on our machines so that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1033.26,1038.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e they could connect to the network.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1038.0,1039.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, um, we didn't have a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1042.2,1045.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e particularly big machine because,\nyou know, we didn't have a massive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1045.96,1050.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e brand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1050.2,1050.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So we said, okay, we can free up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1054.54,1057.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e two RS-232 ports, just a simple\ntext only way to connect to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1057.34,1067.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1067.6,1068.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And since these ports cost, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1069.2,1071.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e know, 500 bucks a piece or\nwhatever, it was just..we told","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1071.78,1075.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e other people if you want more you\ncan pay for it yourself,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1075.6,1078.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e basically.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1078.62,1079.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And nobody wanted to pay for it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1080.18,1081.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e themselves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1081.72,1082.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So there were two ports being","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1082.22,1084.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e shared by the entire department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1084.74,1086.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And you can imagine this got into","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1090.08,1092.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e some uncomfortable situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1096.02,1097.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at that point, I was already","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1098.58,1100.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e sort of the main system\nadministrator for that machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1100.6,1104.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I was, of course, the\nperson they complained to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1104.8,1108.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And usually, of course, they\ncouldn't do anything about it, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1109.44,1113.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e they complained to me anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1113.64,1115.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at some point, I made the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1115.5,1116.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e observation that what most people\nwanted access to was email.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1116.84,1125.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Now, it turns out we already had\na- another very slow, also","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1126.5,1132.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e terminal-based network called\nBirknet, which was a project done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1135.06,1141.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e by a guy named Eric Schmidt, who\nlater became CEO of Google.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1141.86,1146.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I worked with Eric.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1146.88,1148.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it would send mail, but only","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1150.84,1154.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e inside the campus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1154.44,1155.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It wouldn't go out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1155.32,1156.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And similarly, mail from ARPANET\nwouldn't go to another machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1158.06,1162.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I said, you know, Birknet\nis software, ARPANET is software,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1162.5,1169.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and I know how to write software.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1169.64,1171.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'll bet I can find some way to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1171.4,1173.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e glue these things together so you\ncan get your email on your home","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1173.28,1178.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e machine, not on your machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1178.48,1181.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was a quick hack called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1183.08,1187.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e DeliverMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1187.04,1187.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I won't say it worked well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1189.12,1191.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e but it did work and so I basically\nwrote Deliver Mail to get people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1191.94,1198.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to stop bothering me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1198.98,1199.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Can you describe Eric Schmidt?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1206.82,1208.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Eric was driven.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1212.82,1213.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I think we all you know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1216.88,1219.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e all the students kind of knew that\nEric was going to be CEO of a big","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1219.12,1223.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company someday because, you know,\nhe got a dual major in business","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1223.0,1227.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and computer science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1227.18,1228.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, I got along with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1231.36,1233.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Eric, but he could be a pain in\nthe butt sometimes, actually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1233.54,1238.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e On the other hand, I could too, so\nit was only fair.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1239.24,1242.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But yeah, he, I mean, I think\ngenuinely he was, he had in his","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1245.46,1251.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e head that he was going to be CEO\nof a major corporation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1251.86,1254.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He just focused his entire life on\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1255.64,1258.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And he succeeded.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1259.48,1260.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, let's go back to your life","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1262.9,1266.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e and career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1266.34,1267.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what about SendMail?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1267.72,1270.009"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, so one of the superstars at\nBerkeley was a guy named Bill Joy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1272.38,1276.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, um, Bill Joy at some point\ndid a, uh, distribution.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1278.24,1284.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So back then it was kind of,\nsuppose you'd call it early days","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1286.52,1292.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e of what we call open source\nsoftware.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1292.4,1294.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It wasn't really because there was\nopen source software back in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1294.76,1297.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e 50s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1297.68,1298.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The IBM share conference was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1298.16,1300.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e called share because it was\nspecifically about, hey, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1300.44,1304.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e here's a tape of the stuff I've\nbeen working on, give me a tape of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1304.24,1307.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e what you've been working on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1307.56,1309.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So just give us a swap meet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1309.04,1311.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Usenix got to be very much like a\nswap meet as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1312.36,1315.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there were a bunch of people\nin the area who were actively","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1315.6,1321.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e working on Unix and developing it\nand whatnot, including Bill and a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1322.08,1328.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e bunch of others at Berkeley and\nTom Farran at the UC San","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1328.76,1333.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Francisco.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1333.2,1333.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so, I mean, there were some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1336.34,1340.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e really exciting meetings in Bill's\noffice sometimes where you get all","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1340.08,1344.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e of these, you know, super high\npowered people hogging the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1344.76,1350.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e whiteboard.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1350.92,1351.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I guess it was actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1351.4,1352.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e chalkboards back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1352.36,1353.674"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ken Thompson came out to Berkeley","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1354.66,1356.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e on sabbatical for a year.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1356.74,1358.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So you know, I have actually I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1358.68,1361.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e have here in my desk drawer a\nlisting of the version 6 UNIX","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1361.86,1367.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e kernel hand-annotated because Ken\nactually gave a free class,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1367.64,1374.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e evening class, where he walked\nthrough the Kernel and taught","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1375.96,1379.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e everyone how it worked.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1379.54,1380.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there were, I think, maybe a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1381.38,1384.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e dozen people in the room.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1384.54,1386.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, now if you were to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1386.54,1387.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e something like that, of course,\nyou have to fire the Coliseum out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1387.92,1392.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so it was a very, very\nexciting environment to be in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1393.94,1398.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, I think I may have\nlost track of the question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1398.9,1401.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e I was asking you about SendMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1403.26,1405.229"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ah, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1406.14,1406.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So Bill did Berkeley software\ndistributions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1410.26,1412.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Can't remember now second, third\nBerkeley software distribution was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1412.98,1422.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e getting to be kind of to the form\nof a whole system and at this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1422.98,1433.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e point it still required an AT\u0026T\nLicense so it wasn't really open","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1433.32,1438.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e source in the way that it is\ntoday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1438.66,1441.867"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But since everyone who was using\nUnix had to have an AT\u0026T license,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1442.92,1448.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was kind of sort of open source\nwithin that community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1448.48,1451.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so Berkeley, so Bob Fabry, who\nwas a faculty member there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1453.86,1461.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e started up the Computer Systems\nResearch Group, CSRG, and hired","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1461.46,1466.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Bill and a bunch of other people\nwhose names you probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1466.74,1470.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e recognize.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1470.36,1470.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And they got a grant from DARPA to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1471.88,1478.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e create the system for the\ninternet, as yet non-existent","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1478.1,1485.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1486.36,1486.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So we ended up doing the TCP/IP","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1488.16,1492.187"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e stack at Berkeley, incorporating\nideas from other places.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1492.76,1496.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't want to say we did\neverything.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1496.6,1498.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We were, in fact, very open to\npicking up other people's work and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1498.94,1504.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e integrating it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1504.86,1505.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And one of the things that was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1510.36,1511.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e needed was a mail system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1511.58,1513.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the mail system for the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1514.34,1516.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e internet was completely, utterly\ndifferent than the mail system on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1516.06,1520.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the ARPANET.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1520.82,1521.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so at that point, I had done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1523.2,1525.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e deliver mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1525.46,1526.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And Bill came to me and said, so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1526.32,1528.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Eric, you know more about email\nthan anyone else here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1528.44,1531.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Why don't you do it?\nAt that point, I was working on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1531.0,1535.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the Ingress project but you know\nnever wanted to pass up an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1535.28,1539.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e interesting problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1539.14,1540.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I agreed to do this and if I had","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1542.04,1543.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e known how hard it was going to be\nI would never have agreed to it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1543.94,1547.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was a lot of work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1547.12,1548.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But, you know, I stuck with it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1549.54,1551.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so when, you know, on the day,\nliterally there was a day when the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1551.76,1556.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Internet got turned on, Sendmail\nwas the mail program for the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1556.82,1561.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e entire Internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1561.82,1562.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it snowballed from there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1564.4,1567.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e During those years you also\nproduced Syslog.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1572.04,1577.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ah, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1577.64,1578.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Syslog, much less exciting I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1579.62,1582.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e suppose, but arguably more\nimportant, was just a way to, for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1582.8,1591.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e various programs to write to a log\nfile to say what they're doing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1591.56,1598.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e which when you're writing programs\nthat you run them and they run and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1598.4,1603.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e then they stop, you can print\nstuff out and so forth and that's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1603.86,1607.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e easy but if you're running writing\na program where it runs in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1607.28,1610.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e background and you never actually\nsee its output, it has to have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1610.94,1614.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e some place where you can figure\nout what's going on when it's not","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1614.94,1617.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e working.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1617.74,1618.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The usual thing then was you open","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1619.28,1621.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e a file and write to that file.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1621.96,1627.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the file is somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1627.2,1629.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There was no standard for where it\nshould be in the file system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1630.28,1633.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So it would always be a, you know,\nwhere do I find the log file for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1633.68,1638.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e this program?\nIt's around here somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1638.68,1640.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Maybe I'll be in somebody's home\ndirectory for all I know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1640.66,1643.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the other thing was when you\nhave multiple writers that, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1644.8,1649.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you're writing to a log file, they\ninteract with each other and you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1649.72,1657.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e can get alphabet soup.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1657.3,1658.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I wanted a system where you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1659.02,1660.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e could send a message to a demon\nthat would look at the message and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1660.92,1666.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e then take a configuration file and\ntell it where that message should","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1666.56,1672.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e be logged.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1672.26,1672.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it could be multiple places.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1673.0,1674.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that syslog is still in use.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1679.9,1682.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's been rewritten since then,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1682.32,1684.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e but it's still fundamentally the\nsame thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1684.08,1686.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's actually, it's an internet\nstandard now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1686.74,1689.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so maybe not the most exciting\nthing I've ever done, but possibly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1691.96,1697.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the most important or impactful\nlet me say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1697.12,1699.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What about dash MI macros?\nAh, the ME macros.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1703.08,1710.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e ME macros, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1710.78,1712.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, yeah, there was, Unix had some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1712.74,1719.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e programs for doing text\nformatting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1719.92,1722.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there was one early on called\nRof, which was very simple.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1724.54,1728.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And then another one came along\ncalled NROF, which was the new","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1730.74,1735.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Rof.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1735.12,1735.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Rof stood for runoff.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1735.68,1737.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So it was the new runoff program.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1737.82,1739.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And then there was another system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1740.36,1743.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that came out compatible with NROF\nlater called TROF, which actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1743.34,1747.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e went to a photo typesetting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1747.4,1748.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But the thing about NROF and TROF","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1750.12,1752.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e is they were almost unusable\nwithout a macro package because it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1752.44,1757.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was a brilliant design that gave\nyou just the very barest tools you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1757.66,1765.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e needed to essentially implement\nyour own language.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1765.52,1768.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And Berkeley had nRoth and I think\nactually had tRoth but it did not","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1769.68,1774.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e have a macro package.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1774.96,1777.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e AT\u0026T wouldn't release that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1777.28,1779.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I decided I was going to\nbuild one because I really wanted","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1779.76,1783.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to use NROF.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1783.5,1784.334"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I ended up doing the ME","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1785.46,1790.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e macros and learned a lot about\nNROFand TROF and typesetting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1790.86,1798.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, I still have my,\nyou know, PICA ruler here and so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1798.48,1805.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e forth from when I was measuring\nstuff out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1805.84,1810.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And yeah, it got used a lot at\nBerkeley and did get distributed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1815.36,1819.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You can still find it on pretty\nmuch any Unix distribution, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1819.54,1822.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e mostly people use other tools\ntoday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1822.96,1825.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, you know, it was cool though.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1826.06,1830.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I think the best thing about it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1830.3,1832.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was, so back then when students\nwere getting their PhDs, they had","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1832.56,1839.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to get it typed up or, you know,\nwe're starting to get to the point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1839.44,1843.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e where it's typeset.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1843.62,1844.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it goes to the something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1844.54,1849.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e graduate office.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1849.64,1850.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there's a woman there who like","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1851.18,1853.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e pulls out a ruler and makes sure\nall of the margins are exactly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1853.94,1857.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e right and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1857.62,1858.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And if they're not, she says, go","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1858.52,1861.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e away, come back when you get it\nright.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1861.06,1863.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e She was called the Dragon Lady.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1863.9,1865.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I added in a macro called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1867.42,1870.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e .th for thesis, and that just set\nall the settings right so it would","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1870.58,1875.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e get past the dragon lady.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1875.58,1877.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that made me a very popular","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1877.58,1879.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1879.16,1879.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And you also wrote Trek, the Unix","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1883.4,1887.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e version of Star Trek video game.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1887.52,1889.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1890.98,1891.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's not the first Trek version,\nalthough I did make some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1892.66,1897.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e enhancements.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1897.76,1898.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There was one written in, I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1898.92,1900.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was Fortran, that somehow I\ncame across.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1900.92,1905.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I think I must have played it\nsomewhere at one point and said","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1906.38,1908.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e this is pretty cool but it should\nrun on the computer that I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1908.94,1911.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e actually have access to and so I\nstarted working on writing track","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1911.82,1919.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e wasn't quite a port of the old one\nbecause I did start pretty much","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1919.24,1923.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e over from scratch and that went\non.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1923.1,1928.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I mentioned the kind of\nrelaxed environment at the Ingress","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1928.6,1932.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e 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on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1946.84,1950.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Ingress, which they should never\nhave let me get away with, but it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1950.48,1954.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was fun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1954.86,1955.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there's an interesting story","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1956.36,1957.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e about Trek.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1958.16,1958.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e People were a lot more casual","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1961.98,1963.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e about privacy issues back then and\nKen Thompson had root super user","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1963.7,1970.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e access to every Unix machine on\ncampus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1970.9,1974.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it turns out that before he\nwent back to Bell labs, he made a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1976.64,1983.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e tape of the entire system,\nincluding all everyone's personal","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1983.04,1986.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e files and so forth and took it\nwith him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1986.86,1991.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so one day I'm working in my\noffice at Ingress.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1992.84,1997.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e At that point I was, I had a\nprivate office because I was the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1998.38,2003.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e guy who did frontline support and\ncan't remember what my title was,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2003.3,2007.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e but I rated a private office and I\ngot this phone call.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2007.34,2010.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And guy comes and says, Hi, I've\nlooked at your Trek program and it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2011.8,2022.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e looks like it's not finished yet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2022.04,2024.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Did you abandon it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2024.44,2025.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I went, no, I did not abandon\nit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2026.06,2030.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I didn't even know you had it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2031.06,2033.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Said, oh, well, Ken brought it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2033.04,2034.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e back from Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2034.36,2035.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I was in the middle of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2035.94,2037.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e developing it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2037.6,2038.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Anyway, He and I started","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2039.54,2041.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e communicating and sharing ideas\nand so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2042.14,2045.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That guy was named Steve Dorn, who\nis known for the Bourne shell and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2045.0,2051.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e several other things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2053.08,2054.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I'm still in contact with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2054.34,2056.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Steve.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2056.5,2057.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, he always called me because","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2062.02,2064.179"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was a long-distance call to New\nJersey and since he worked for the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2064.36,2068.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e phone company he got free calls\nand we had very expensive calls.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2068.9,2072.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So that was the arrangement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2073.08,2074.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e In 1981, you had a summer job at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2079.34,2085.219"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e the International Institute for\nApplied Systems Analysis in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2085.219,2091.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Luxembourg, Austria, Europe as a\nconsultant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2091.06,2094.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Can you tell us more about this\nexperience?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2095.76,2097.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e How did you get this job?\nAnd what was your impression of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2098.48,2103.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Europe in the early 80s?\nSo there was a guy who was a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2103.48,2115.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e scientist mostly working on energy\nrelated matters.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2115.08,2122.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Back before energy was a trendy\nthing to work on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2122.68,2125.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And he had done stints at IASA,\nInternational Institute 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uh","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2148.64,2153.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e certainly wasn't you know you go\ndown to the corner store and buy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2153.44,2156.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e yourself a Mac or anything 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and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2175.86,2181.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e went to build this thing called\nfeds the front-end system, zystem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2181.36,2185.769"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I guess I don't know and I quickly\nfound out why this thing had 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And I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2218.66,2225.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e said, you know, I'm going to get\nthis to work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2225.14,2227.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And by God, at the end of the\nsummer, it 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actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2234.38,2237.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e use, but it did work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2237.48,2239.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the other thing that was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2241.18,2243.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e interesting about that job was, it\nwas, the Institute itself was in a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2243.24,2252.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e palace, one of Maria Theresa's\nsummer palaces.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2252.04,2256.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And my office had been friends of\nJoseph's library and big, huge","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2258.44,2269.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e glass doors all around the outside\nof the building so I could just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2269.74,2273.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e walk through that door and I'd be\nin a I think it was 40 hectare","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2273.72,2277.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e park and wander around if I wanted\nto stop and think about something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2277.24,2282.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there was a castle in the\nmiddle of the park that was built","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2282.96,2287.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e for Marie Antoinette as a\ndollhouse, but, you 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it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2292.34,2293.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And another interesting thing\nabout YASA was it was, I think at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2297.1,2303.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that time, the only scientific\ninstitute in the world that 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a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2313.18,2318.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e lot of the stuff I'd been taught\nin school maybe not have been","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2318.68,2321.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e completely accurate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2321.78,2322.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Like these were people who, one","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2323.06,2326.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e guy was very concerned because his\nwife had to go to the hospital and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2326.2,2330.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e she wasn't with him, she was back\nin Soviet Union.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2330.42,2334.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And just the outpouring of, you\nknow, I can't really say love, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2335.36,2343.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e concern for him, made it very\nclear to me that most people in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2343.3,2351.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Russia just want to live their\nlives kind of like we do and that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2351.24,2356.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was a good thing for me to learn.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2356.02,2361.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there was a Polish guy who was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2361.62,2363.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e involved with the, what was the\nunion, solidarity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2363.6,2368.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I actually have a solidarity union\npin around here somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2369.02,2373.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And we had United Nations access,\nso I had access to the UN","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2374.94,2380.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e commissary, and everything was tax\nfree, and all over the world, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2380.32,2384.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2384.3,2385.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was just a splendid summer, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2385.06,2386.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e have to say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2386.76,2387.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was also my first time in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2388.44,2389.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Europe, and so it's been kind of\ndisappointing ever since to not be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2389.84,2394.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e in something quite that exciting,\nbut I love Europe anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2394.78,2398.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Did you travel around Europe when\nyou were there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2400.24,2403.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e That's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2404.76,2405.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e No, I did not.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2407.94,2410.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I certainly have traveled a fair\namount since, but at that point, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2411.04,2415.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e remember I was taking leave from\nwork and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2415.66,2418.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I kind of had to get back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2418.22,2420.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I was in a relationship then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2421.4,2427.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e In fact, the relationship I'm\nstill in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2427.66,2429.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I wanted to get back home\nand be able to cuddle with my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2430.86,2436.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e honey.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2436.76,2437.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So you were back home and in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2440.52,2446.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e November 1981, you joined Britton\nLee, Pioneering Relational","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2446.64,2453.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Database Company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2454.08,2455.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So I have the feeling that some of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2456.16,2460.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e your colleagues at Berkeley\ninvited you there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2460.92,2464.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Very true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2465.08,2465.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, Britton Lee was a Ingress","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2467.0,2471.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e spin-off, kind of an interesting,\nmaybe a little schizophrenic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2471.6,2478.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2478.3,2478.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The people who founded it were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2478.94,2480.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e hardware guys and so they wanted\nto build a special-purpose","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2481.16,2484.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e computer that would run database\napplications.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2484.64,2487.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And they didn't realize that the\nsecret sauce in the database","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2490.04,2495.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e system is not the hardware, it's\nthe software.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2495.08,2497.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So there was a software group in\nBerkeley, even though most of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2498.8,2503.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company was in Los Gatos.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2503.38,2505.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I got hired in initially to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2506.24,2510.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e manage the, what was called the\nhost software group, which is to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2510.56,2517.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e say the things that run on your\ncomputers that talk to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2517.6,2520.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e database computer, we call it a\ndatabase machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2520.98,2524.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Then it was really one of the\nfirst cases of client-server, so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2524.62,2529.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was really a database server,\nbut that's not what the word was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2529.02,2533.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2533.68,2534.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so all of the user interfaces","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2535.42,2538.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that people would use, which was\nmostly programmatic interfaces.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2538.74,2544.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I kind of got a group together\nAnd one of the best hires I've","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2546.16,2555.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e ever made, in fact, was a guy\nnamed Greg Olson, who I'll talk","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2555.14,2560.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e about later some more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2560.08,2561.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, we were doing some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2562.62,2564.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e good work, But I was having, this\nwas my first management job and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2564.34,2570.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/747","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e did not particularly like\nmanagement jobs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2570.24,2572.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/748","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So at some point I went to my boss\nand I said, I wanna go back to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2572.66,2578.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/749","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e being an engineer, way better at\nit than I am being a manager.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2578.0,2581.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/750","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And you know I'd like to do it\nhere and work on this stuff but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2583.24,2588.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you know if you can't do that I'll\nfind another job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2588.94,2593.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And to his credit, he didn't say,\nwell, bye, see you later.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2595.3,2602.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He, in fact, did put me down to\nbeing a wine engineer again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2603.2,2608.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And by the way, did not cut my\nsalary amazingly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2608.52,2611.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And but the flip side is he took\nthis guy, Greg Olson, who was my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2614.46,2619.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e best engineer and made him my\nboss.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2619.02,2621.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I've always wondered if he\nwasn't doing that in the hopes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2622.4,2625.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that I would find that such an\ninsult that I would quit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2625.84,2628.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/759","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Um, but in fact, Greg was the\nperfect boss.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2629.84,2633.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/760","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I mean, like day one, he came in\nand said, Eric, you're a way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2633.72,2637.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e better programmer than I'll ever\nbe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2637.56,2639.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So how about, you know, we kind of\ndo this together and you manage","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2640.06,2644.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the technology and I'll manage\nmanagement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2644.94,2648.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it worked great.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2649.96,2651.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Really worked well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2652.26,2653.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I ended up doing a system there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2654.22,2657.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Um, basically I came to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2658.92,2663.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e conclusion that it was too hard to\nbuild database applications and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2663.12,2666.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e there was no reason the database\napplication had to be really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2666.12,2668.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e difficult.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2668.94,2669.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I built a system called ADIT,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2669.44,2671.394"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Advanced Database Interface Tools,\nthat included a graphic component","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2671.56,2677.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e so that you could actually do\nstuff that you couldn't do on the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2678.12,2681.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Fez system back in Austria.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2681.74,2683.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I got it to the point where it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2683.36,2685.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was prototyped.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2685.82,2687.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Still needed a lot of work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2688.94,2690.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But it was getting to the point\nwhere it became clear that we were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2691.1,2694.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e going to need marketing support.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2694.44,2696.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so we did a big all day demo.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2697.3,2699.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e VP of marketing came up to\nBerkeley, we gave him, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2700.06,2705.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e this big tour, showed him all the\nstuff it could do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2705.28,2708.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at the end of the day, he\nsaid, you know, you engineers","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2708.34,2713.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e always, you just have your heads\nin the clouds.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2713.54,2715.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e People don't want these.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2716.4,2717.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You're using Sun workstations,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2718.12,2719.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e which are kind of expensive at the\ntime, I suppose.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2719.64,2722.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e People don't want workstations.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2723.0,2724.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e They're way too expensive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2724.96,2726.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e They want PC applications.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2726.18,2729.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e They want text-only PC","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2729.34,2731.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e applications, because graphics\nwasn't big on the PC.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2731.5,2734.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And after I picked my job off the\nfloor, best I could come up with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2736.28,2744.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e is they will be asking for 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all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2750.02,2751.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that's when I realized I had\nto shut down the project, which I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2751.76,2755.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e did over, you know, sort of\ncleaned it all up, documented 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was\nimportant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2763.2,2766.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e This is part of the thing where\nBritton Lee was a hardware","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2766.98,2770.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company, not a software company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2770.28,2771.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e What I was doing was software and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2772.16,2774.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e hence not valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2774.18,2775.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I ended up meeting up with a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2777.5,2783.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e friend of mine who had been a grad\nstudent when I was at Berkeley,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2783.8,2787.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and he was working at a new place\ncalled the International Computer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2789.02,2795.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Science Institute, ICSI.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2795.6,2797.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I jumped from Britton Lee","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2800.68,2803.027"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to ICSI, which was an easy jump to\ndo because they were a block apart","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2803.66,2808.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e in Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2808.4,2809.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Didn't have to rent a truck or","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2810.74,2812.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e anything.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2812.24,2812.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And am I getting too far ahead","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2814.44,2817.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e here?\nThat's perfect.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2817.1,2818.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, yeah, no. So that was in 88\nwhen you joined the speech group","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2819.16,2825.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e at the International Computer\nScience Institute, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2825.22,2828.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Sounds about right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2828.76,2829.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I have to look at my resume.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2830.44,2831.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm not very good on remembering\ndates.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2831.82,2833.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, Morgan, who was known then\njust as Morgan, his full name was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2836.18,2841.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e actually Nelson Morgan, had been\nworking on digital audio as a 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to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2852.06,2854.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e ICSE.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2854.3,2854.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He developed an interest in speech","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2855.66,2857.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e recognition and so he started up a\ngroup which was called the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2857.44,2863.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Realization Group.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2863.58,2864.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There were a bunch of little","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2864.68,2865.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e groups inside of ICSE.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2865.48,2866.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was funded by the German","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2866.84,2868.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e government, although it was\nassociated with Berkeley, so we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2868.12,2871.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e had access to Berkeley networks\nand things, but we didn't get a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2871.5,2875.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Berkeley paycheck.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2875.12,2876.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I had what is undoubtedly the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2879.66,2882.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e most spectacular office I have\never had in my career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2882.64,2886.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was huge.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2886.22,2888.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You could probably play basketball","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2888.74,2891.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e in it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2891.74,2892.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Nice job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2897.86,2898.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But So the point of ICSI, Jerry\nFeldman, who was the director of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2899.5,2906.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the Institute, was a lot on these\nthings called neural networks.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2906.98,2910.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And neural networks had been a\nthing back in the 60s and then had","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2912.22,2916.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e kind of fallen out of 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a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2922.34,2928.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e form of artificial intelligence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2928.48,2930.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Now we call them deep learning and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2931.2,2933.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it's the big rage right now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2934.16,2936.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But back then hardware was 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array","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2945.26,2948.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e processor, which was a unusual\narchitecture because the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2948.68,2956.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e communication paths could only go\nto the left or to the right but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2956.46,2962.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e couldn't go to an arbitrary\nanother node so a whole bunch of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2962.2,2965.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e computers in a box and it turns\nout that was a great architecture","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2965.14,2971.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e for doing neural networks and I\nwas writing software for it and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2971.92,2977.85"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e actually didn't stay too long at\nICSI because it turns out that 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didn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3011.98,3018.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/869","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e really spend a lot of time at it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3018.26,3020.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/870","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Nonetheless, it was fun doing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3021.34,3024.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/871","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e something new.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3024.28,3024.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/872","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's been a theme through 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going","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3028.84,3030.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/875","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to work on this, and they figure\nthat out in grad school and they","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3030.96,3034.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/876","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e spend their entire career working\non that and I'm the sort of person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3034.0,3037.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/877","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e who every five years or so gets\nbored and says I want to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3037.86,3040.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/878","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e something completely different And\nthat was completely different.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3040.96,3044.743"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/879","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So in 1989 you moved back to the\nUniversity of California Berkeley","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3047.14,3051.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/880","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e as the lead programmer on the\nMammoth project.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3051.74,3055.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/881","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3057.42,3057.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/882","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What was the Mammoth 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Unix.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3080.76,3081.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/887","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You had your own computer and your","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3082.3,3083.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/888","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e own system administrator, and you\nmanaged your own machine, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3083.88,3088.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/889","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e everyone tended to customize their\nown software.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3088.7,3091.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/890","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it was starting to become a\nproblem because two groups 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couldn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3099.72,3102.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/893","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e fit them together because they or\nuse different versions of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3102.52,3107.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/894","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e compiler or something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3107.8,3109.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/895","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so, um, a professor, Susan","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3110.98,3116.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/896","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Graham, um, became the PI on the\nMammoth project.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3116.74,3123.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/897","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the idea was we got an\nactually really big grant to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3123.48,3128.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/898","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e install and manage infrastructure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3129.0,3130.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/899","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so we had a CM5 from Thinking","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3132.34,3138.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/900","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Machines, which was a parallel\ncomputer at that point, which I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3138.4,3143.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/901","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e don't quite know how they talked\nthinking machines into letting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3145.28,3149.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/902","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e them have one for a fraction of\nthe price because these things...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3149.72,3153.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/903","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e so there's at the end of the rack\nthere's a panel filled with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3153.18,3162.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/904","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e blinking lights and you've seen it\nin Jurassic Park because in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3162.04,3169.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/905","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e scene where the girl goes into the\nmachine room and goes \"Oh, this is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3169.14,3174.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/906","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Unix.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3174.02,3174.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/907","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I know how to use this.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3174.44,3175.767"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/908","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The machine was actually a CM5 and\nin fact the guy who maintained our","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3175.767,3182.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/909","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e machine was the one who installed\nthat on the set.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3182.78,3185.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/910","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it turns out there were no\nprocessors at all in that box.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3186.22,3190.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/911","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The lights flashing, there was a\nseparate processor just to blink","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3190.76,3196.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/912","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the lights.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3196.68,3197.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/913","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It did absolutely nothing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3197.62,3199.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/914","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so they had an empty box.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3201.28,3205.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/915","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We had a box with a few things in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3205.64,3209.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/916","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3209.08,3209.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/917","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that machine, that panel was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3210.1,3213.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/918","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e so heavy that it took two people\nto lift it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3213.42,3216.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/919","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was just, the machine was a\ndisaster in terms of actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3216.9,3222.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/920","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e being usable and maintainable and\nso forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3224.34,3227.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/921","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Anyway, that was one of the\nthings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3227.92,3229.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/922","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Another one was a compute machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3231.3,3235.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/923","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e This is back in the time when","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3237.06,3238.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/924","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e people are starting to say maybe\nthis parallel processing stuff is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3238.38,3241.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/925","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e a good idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3241.84,3242.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/926","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so they got a, oh, come on, it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3243.74,3250.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/927","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was running RISC-OS.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3250.58,3251.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/928","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was a, I can't remember the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3251.92,3253.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/929","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e manufacturer now, but I think it\nwas the 32 processor system, which","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3253.32,3256.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/930","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was about the biggest you could\nget back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3256.5,3258.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/931","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the third one was a disk\nserver, which we got from another","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3260.9,3269.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/932","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3269.44,3269.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/933","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the idea was people could get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3271.0,3276.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/934","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e time, counts, whatever, on any of\nthese resources.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3276.04,3279.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/935","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that way they wouldn't have to\nmanage the machines themselves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3280.84,3284.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/936","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So on the disk servers we built\nsomething called the software","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3286.74,3290.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/937","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e warehouse, which basically said,\nlet's find all the interesting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3290.92,3295.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/938","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e software that anyone might wanna\nuse, we'll put it in one place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3295.58,3298.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/939","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it'll be shared through the whole\ndepartment, we will maintain it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3298.84,3302.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/940","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so all of these people who\nhave been spending all their time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3303.26,3306.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/941","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e doing system administration can\nactually do real research.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3306.42,3309.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/942","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it was incredibly successful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3310.08,3312.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/943","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at a group there, at that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3315.6,3319.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/944","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e point, I was a manager again, but\nI was getting to be better at it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3319.18,3322.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/945","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I had been in my first\nmanagement job and yeah, it was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3322.9,3330.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/946","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e kind of changed the whole culture\nin the department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3334.12,3336.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/947","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I was a very popular guy in the\ndepartment for a while.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3337.86,3341.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/948","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But the problem with the mammoth\nproject is it had gotten to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3342.18,3345.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/949","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e point where it was starting to\nbecome a, okay, just keep things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3345.84,3349.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/950","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e running.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3349.84,3350.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/951","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so it was a maintenance job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3351.1,3355.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/952","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I was, like I said, every five\nyears I get itchy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3355.76,3360.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/953","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I got itchy and decided to\nleave.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3360.36,3365.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/954","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was 1995.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3366.28,3367.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/955","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3371.64,3372.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/956","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e You joined in reference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3372.56,3374.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/957","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, well, there's twice in my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3376.32,3378.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/958","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e life where I've taken jobs that\nwere really a mistake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3378.42,3381.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/959","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I think that was one of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3382.36,3383.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/960","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It looked kind of cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3383.86,3385.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/961","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But first of all, it was in\nSunnyvale, so I had to commute","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3390.06,3393.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/962","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e from Berkeley, which was, I don't\nlike to drive, and so that was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3393.34,3397.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/963","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e terrible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3397.28,3397.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/964","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But the other thing was, the guy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3397.8,3401.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/965","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e who founded it turns out didn't\nseem to know what the product was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3401.8,3409.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/966","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that he was trying to build.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3409.12,3410.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/967","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so every time I was the chief","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3412.0,3415.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/968","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e technology officer and at that\npoint I had kind of a name so he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3415.08,3418.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/969","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e always wanted to strut me out to\nshow people that we had this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3418.48,3423.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/970","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e techie guy on his staff and I\nlearned to keep my mouth shut","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3424.32,3428.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/971","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e until I found out what the product\nwas today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3430.4,3433.547"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/972","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And then I had to ad lib it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3435.06,3437.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/973","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So that was just kind of a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3438.4,3443.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/974","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e disaster.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3443.94,3444.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/975","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I ended up leaving that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3445.84,3448.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/976","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It ended up getting sold off to\nanother place which was an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3449.44,3455.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/977","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e internet ad company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3455.02,3456.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/978","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So in reference turned into an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3456.76,3458.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/979","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e internet ad company but that was\nafter I left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3458.36,3461.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/980","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Trust me I wouldn't do that to\nyou.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3461.1,3463.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/981","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what happened when you left in\nreference?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3465.72,3468.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/982","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, that was a painful\nexperience, both between the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3470.14,3478.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/983","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e commute and the uncertainty of the\njob and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3478.84,3482.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/984","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I realized I had enough money\nin the bank that I could probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3482.92,3487.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/985","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e survive for six months without too\nmuch trouble.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3487.6,3491.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/986","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I was basically acting as a\nconsultant and I was working on I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3495.34,3501.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/987","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e wrote, co-authored a book on send\nmail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3501.14,3504.874"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/988","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That was during that time I did\nsome other well, I did other","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3505.76,3515.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/989","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e consulting a big one there being a\ncompany that wanted to do mass","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3515.22,3523.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/990","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e mailing, which, you know, now\neveryone has this, but back then","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3523.98,3530.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/991","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was a new thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3530.46,3532.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/992","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Anyway, I was here in Berkeley,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3532.74,3535.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/993","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e down at Pete's, which is two\nblocks from my house getting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3536.32,3539.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/994","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e coffee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3539.26,3539.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/995","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And who did I run into but Greg","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3540.66,3544.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/996","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Olson, same guy I'd worked with at\nBritton Lee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3544.54,3547.581"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/997","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And you know, I'd had in the back\nof my head a thing of, well, maybe","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3547.8,3552.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/998","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I could get some companies\ntogether and create a consortium","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3552.38,3558.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/999","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that, you know, they'd each give\nme a small amount of money to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3559.54,3563.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1000","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e develop and maintain Sendmail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3563.32,3565.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1001","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I could hire somebody to do the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3565.6,3567.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1002","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e frontline support, which was\ntaking up more and more of my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3567.56,3570.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1003","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3570.42,3570.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1004","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, free email consulting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3571.22,3573.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1005","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was spending half my day every\nday just answering mail, most of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3573.7,3577.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1006","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e which was, see this page.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3577.36,3579.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1007","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's documented, look it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3580.28,3582.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1008","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I had gone to some couple other\nplaces and the general attitude","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3584.7,3592.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1009","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e seemed to be, yeah, we would fund\nyou for that as long as we own it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3592.34,3597.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1010","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I'm like, no, that's not the\npoint.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3598.28,3600.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1011","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Point is, if ownership is spread\nout and nobody would go for that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3600.24,3605.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1012","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and so Greg at that point had gone\nstayed on the management route and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3606.6,3611.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1013","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e he had been you know VP of\nmarketing, and VP of engineering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3611.28,3615.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1014","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and VP of sales and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3615.36,3617.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1015","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So you had all of these, this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3617.22,3618.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1016","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e background and how companies\nactually work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3618.9,3621.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1017","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I told him about this and he\nsaid, you know, I'm between jobs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3621.6,3628.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1018","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e right now and I'm kind of doing\nbusiness consulting and I'll help","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3628.34,3632.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1019","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you write a business plan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3632.54,3633.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1020","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You could do a company, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3634.3,3636.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1021","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e just a standalone company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3636.84,3638.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1022","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so we spent that summer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3639.64,3641.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1023","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e working on a business plan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3641.54,3643.574"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1024","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And when the whole thing came","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3645.06,3649.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1025","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e together, I basically said, I'll\ngive you half the company if you'd","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3649.44,3653.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1026","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e be my CEO.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3653.42,3654.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1027","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so he did that and was a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3655.76,3659.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1028","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e really great CEO.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3659.86,3661.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1029","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And yeah, it was pretty heady.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3665.36,3670.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1030","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We made the front page of the New\nYork Times when we announced the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3671.98,3675.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1031","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3675.04,3675.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1032","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So that was in March 1998.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3677.94,3680.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1033","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, that's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3686.28,3687.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1034","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3687.52,3688.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1035","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was thinking it was earlier, but\nno, that's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3688.04,3691.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1036","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So you know, we, SendMail had a\nreputation for being difficult to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3693.82,3700.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1037","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e configure so our first thing was\nwe'll make it easy to configure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3700.9,3704.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1038","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and using a graphic user interface\nand so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3706.22,3709.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1039","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, well, I could go through the\nwhole history of SendMail, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3710.74,3716.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1040","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e probably it's only of interest to\nthree people in the world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3717.62,3720.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1041","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, if there's anything in\nparticular you're interested in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3720.06,3725.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1042","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e The evolution of the company, when\nyou founded it, and what happened","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3727.82,3733.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1043","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e eventually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3733.66,3734.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1044","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And what were the key events?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3735.66,3738.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1045","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I was Chief Technology Officer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3745.08,3746.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1046","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was acting as VP of engineering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3749.7,3751.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1047","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e at first but we had to get another\nVP of engineering because two","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3752.36,3758.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1048","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e things actually one was part of VP\nof engineering is doing budgets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3758.68,3765.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1049","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and things like that which was not\nsomething that really got me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3765.74,3770.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1050","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e excited.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3770.44,3770.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1051","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But the other thing was, and this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3771.3,3774.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1052","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e is probably a mistake I made at\nSendmail, the marketing department","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3774.02,3778.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1053","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e at that point, I really had a\nreputation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3778.1,3780.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1054","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So the marketing department wanted\nto, you know, bring me out to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3781.02,3785.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1055","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e speak in front of customers and\nstuff, you know, at conferences,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3785.66,3790.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1056","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e etc. So, I ended up flying all\nover the world, meeting customers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3790.38,3799.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1057","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There was one time when I had been\nin Europe for, you know, probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3800.6,3805.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1058","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e four or five different countries\nin Europe, had to fly back to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3805.68,3810.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1059","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Berkeley for some meeting or\nevent, and the very next day flew","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3810.82,3815.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1060","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to Japan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3815.76,3816.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1061","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So it was kind of grueling.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3819.28,3821.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1062","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I ended up doing more\nmarketing actually than","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3828.62,3831.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1063","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e technology, which kind of bummed\nme out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3831.38,3833.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1064","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We did get some important things\ndone here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3834.24,3838.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1065","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We came up with the Miltur\ninterface, stood for mail filter.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3838.94,3843.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1066","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was a way to do plugins\ninto SendMail to do mail","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3844.14,3849.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1067","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e filtering, which can be arbitrary,\nbut of course the big thing back","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3849.96,3853.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1068","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e then was anti-spam.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3853.86,3855.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1069","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Spam was becoming a really serious","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3856.78,3858.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1070","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3858.84,3859.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1071","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The milter interface was very","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3859.64,3862.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1072","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e successful to the extent that\nother MTAs that are out there are","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3862.64,3868.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1073","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e compatible with the SendMail\nmilters.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3868.92,3871.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1074","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I worked on some standards for\nthe IETF, the Internet Engineering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3872.98,3878.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1075","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Task Force, which sets the\nstandards for the Internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3878.56,3882.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1076","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e In particular one called DKIM,\nDomain Keys Identified Mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3883.08,3886.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1077","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3889.56,3890.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1078","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The standards process is an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3893.3,3895.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1079","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e interesting one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3895.24,3896.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1080","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I ended up, I did that and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3896.6,3899.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1081","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e then decided I didn't wanna do\nstandards anymore just because it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3899.54,3903.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1082","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was tedious.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3903.48,3904.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1083","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there were some people there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3904.3,3907.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1084","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e who were very, very difficult to\nwork with, and you couldn't get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3907.9,3912.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1085","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e rid of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3912.28,3913.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1086","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So that was the end of my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3914.12,3916.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1087","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e standards career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3916.56,3917.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1088","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And then, this is gonna sound a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3918.94,3922.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1089","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e little bizarre, but one of my\nlucky breaks was I was diagnosed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3922.2,3927.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1090","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e with prostate cancer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3927.1,3928.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1091","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I know you don't think of that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3930.06,3934.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1092","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e as a lucky break, but I was 51,\n52, I think then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3934.28,3939.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1093","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I decided I would have\nsurgery.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3940.16,3946.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1094","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there was, of course, a\nrecovery period from surgery.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3947.66,3950.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1095","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I ended up taking some time\noff and eventually went to part","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3952.92,3957.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1096","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3957.72,3958.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1097","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that got me a little bit away","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3960.82,3964.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1098","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and you know, I continued working\nthere for a while but realized","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3964.16,3969.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1099","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that I'd come in once a week and\nsay hi to people but that was not","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3969.44,3974.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e all I was doing and I don't like\ndoing jobs which are nothing, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3974.76,3979.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e know, getting paid to do nothing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3979.28,3981.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Didn't sit well with me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3983.24,3984.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So at that some point I left\nSendmail, which was right about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3984.6,3990.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e the time it was acquired by\nProofpoint.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3990.56,3992.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And things worked out pretty well\nactually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3994.04,3998.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1106","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e The customers, all the products\ncontinued to be supported.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3999.14,4002.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1107","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e The employees, except for upper\nmanagement, kept their jobs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4003.52,4007.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, it was, you know,\nI'm kind of sorry that Sendmail","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4009.6,4014.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e didn't turn into a big star, but\nit wasn't adequate result.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4014.66,4021.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Unfortunately, the investors,\nmyself included, didn't do very","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4022.74,4026.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4026.92,4027.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what did you do when you left","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4035.82,4038.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e SendMail?\nYeah, that was the second time I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4038.08,4044.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e made a kind of job mistake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4044.16,4047.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I went to work at a company in San","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4050.66,4053.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Francisco, which perhaps I\nshouldn't name, but doing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4053.24,4057.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e streaming database queries.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4060.68,4061.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So taking SQL and instead of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4062.4,4067.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e having it say, here's the data,\nyou know, tell me what the average","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4067.22,4070.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e salary is, it would watch the data\nas it came through, computing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4070.92,4074.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e things and picking out other\nthings, which was actually an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4075.68,4079.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e interesting idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4079.64,4080.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's actually a pretty good idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4080.56,4082.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But it was, the coding was all in\nC++, a language that I despise,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4082.9,4087.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and Java, a language which I\ndidn't really know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4088.72,4092.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the management at that company\nwas very, very proud of the fact","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4092.98,4097.979"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that they had a million lines of\nsource code.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4097.979,4101.399"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And they're like, ooh, we're gonna\ntell everyone how much source code","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4101.7,4104.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e we have.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4104.62,4104.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the engineers are all going,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4104.96,4106.479"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e no, don't do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4106.479,4108.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We have a million lines of source","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4109.6,4111.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e code because we couldn't figure\nout how to make it smaller.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4111.2,4114.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so that was a very\ndemoralizing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4116.76,4119.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I think I did one, you know, made\none innovation where I discovered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4119.64,4124.819"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e an N squared algorithm in the\nthing, but which was, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4124.819,4129.779"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that's a big deal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4129.779,4131.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I felt like I wasn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4133.6,4135.359"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e succeeding very well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4136.899,4138.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I was thinking, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4138.04,4139.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e maybe after all that time at\nSendmail where I basically wasn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4139.54,4143.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e writing any code anymore and maybe\nI just couldn't do it anymore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4143.08,4146.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I ended up putting my tail\nbetween my legs and gave that one","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4146.779,4153.279"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4153.279,4153.779"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e In 2011 you kind of retired.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4155.939,4159.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what did you do?\nWell, yeah, I I did actually try","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4160.14,4164.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to retire I.. you know did some\nbut I was basically saying okay,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4164.72,4174.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you know at this point I've got\nenough money in the bank.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4174.92,4178.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, Sendmail was paying me\npretty well, but I live a pretty","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4178.859,4183.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e frugal lifestyle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4183.2,4184.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I had actually amassed a nice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4184.34,4188.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e nest egg.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4188.46,4189.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so back in my mammoth days,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4190.859,4197.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e one of the things that happened\nwas the computer science","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4198.82,4201.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e department moved into a new\nbuilding and so all of those","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4201.56,4206.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e computers and things that I was\ntalking about had to move from the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4206.56,4210.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e old building into the new building\nand the new building had to have a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4210.44,4214.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e whole new network and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4214.86,4217.587"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I worked with another staff","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4219.38,4222.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e member, a guy named Ken Lutz, who\nas near as I can tell has worked","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4222.04,4228.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e on every interesting project that\nBerkeley has ever done in computer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4228.74,4231.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4231.96,4232.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He's, you know, did RAID and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4232.36,4234.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e network abort stations and all\nthese really cool projects.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4234.2,4237.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I ran into him, actually, no, I\ndidn't run into him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4238.4,4241.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He called me, I guess, and said,\nyou know, Eric, I'm working at a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4241.32,4248.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e new research lab called the Swarm\nLab at Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4248.62,4253.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there's some stuff going on\nhere I think you might find","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4253.5,4256.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4256.76,4257.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And we have seminars at lunchtime","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4257.8,4260.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e on Thursdays, free lunch.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4260.36,4261.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Why don't you come up and see what","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4262.14,4263.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e we're doing?\" I went, well sure,\nokay, free lunch, got me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4263.62,4267.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I went up and indeed it was\nvery interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4269.22,4273.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Now this was the first time I've\nbeen in a lab which looked like a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4273.24,4278.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e lab.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4278.16,4278.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e This is where they have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4278.84,4280.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e oscilloscopes and signal\ngenerators and microscopes and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4280.46,4287.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e heavy duty chemicals and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4287.26,4289.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I was a software guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4290.02,4291.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But it was still really\ninteresting stuff.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4291.32,4293.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I ended up hanging out at a\nresearch project and at some point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4294.24,4300.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was hanging out enough that they\nended up hiring me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4300.24,4304.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I went back to work, working\nfor the university.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4305.06,4309.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so that I believe will be the\nlast job of my career unless","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4310.82,4315.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e something changes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4315.74,4316.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I bracketed my career with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4316.64,4320.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e university jobs, which, you know,\nI'm not unhappy about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4320.44,4326.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I do have to say like I said\nafter I finished with the previous","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4327.72,4332.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e company I was really kind of\ndemoralized, convinced that I just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4332.56,4337.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e couldn't program anymore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4337.96,4339.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I ended up writing most of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4341.34,4343.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e code for that research project and\nkind of got my mojo back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4343.32,4348.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So it was a good job and I loved\nworking with him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4349.6,4353.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He was absolutely fabulous guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4353.56,4356.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So during your career, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4359.78,4361.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e received many honors and in\nparticular, In 2014, you were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4361.24,4369.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e inducted to the Internet Hall of\nFame.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4369.2,4371.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4373.24,4373.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Did you expect that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4374.24,4375.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Did I expect that?\nNot at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4376.74,4381.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, I don't quite remember how\nit even came about but yeah, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4384.7,4390.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e flew to Hong Kong for that\nceremony and you know, they they","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4390.38,4394.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e made a big deal out of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4394.3,4395.686"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And they end up having a whole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4395.94,4404.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e bunch of really interesting\npeople.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4404.76,4407.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e It turns out I already personally\nknew some of the inductees,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4407.1,4411.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e including Paul Bixey, who was\ninducted the same time I was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4413.28,4417.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So he and I ran around Hong Kong\ntogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4417.28,4419.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e That was pretty cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4419.28,4420.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And yeah, you know, it was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4427.86,4429.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e obviously for internet mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4429.94,4431.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e And they had some clever way of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4433.1,4436.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e making it sound more important\nthan it actually was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4436.58,4438.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e But there you go.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4438.86,4440.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e You have been involved in Usenix","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4447.06,4448.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e since the 70s, 1970s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4449.52,4452.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4454.2,4454.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What have been your roles in the\nyears?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4455.04,4458.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, so I started just attending\nUSENIX.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4460.86,4467.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The first USENIX I went to was in\nSan Francisco.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4467.78,4470.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And Tom Ferron, who I mentioned\nearlier, was chairing that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4471.86,4478.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e conference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4478.8,4479.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it was an amazingly wonderful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4479.9,4483.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e conference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4483.48,4483.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's like you know I'm with my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4483.94,4486.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e people here This is great and so I\nstarted going to more conferences","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4486.24,4492.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and eventually I ended up on the\nboard of directors and did that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4492.54,4500.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e for several years and several\ndifferent roles I think I was Vice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4500.8,4506.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e President at one point and\nTreasurer another point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4506.14,4508.887"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But there are term limits on the\nusing sport, which is a good","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4510.28,4513.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4513.34,4513.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I believe in term limits and so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4513.52,4515.372"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm still however on the audit\ncommittee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4518.82,4521.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So every year we get together and\ngo through the audits of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4521.82,4525.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e finances to make sure there's no\nhanky-panky going on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4525.72,4530.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I'm still connected with these\nthings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4531.18,4533.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So you publish several papers,\nbooks, articles.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4536.28,4541.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What is the publication you are\nmost proud of?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4542.66,4547.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I don't know that I\nwould say pride exactly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4550.38,4554.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know some of them have been\nimportant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4558.78,4559.509"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There's been you know papers that\ncame out with important.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4559.509,4560.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There's been papers that came out\nassociated with Ingress that have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4562.06,4570.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e made an impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4570.58,4571.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was on the editorial review","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4573.68,4577.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e board of, not unit review, that's\na different one, of ACM Q","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4577.54,4583.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Magazine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4583.24,4583.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And as a result of being on that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4584.62,4586.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e board, wrote a lot of articles for\nQ, which was designed more for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4586.2,4590.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e practitioners.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4591.06,4591.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So it wasn't, you know, hardcore","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4591.86,4593.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e bits and bytes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4593.8,4594.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And one of those, managing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4595.9,4599.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e technical debt, turns out to now\nbe probably my most referenced","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4599.02,4604.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e paper ever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4604.38,4607.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e People are referencing it all over","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4608.78,4610.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4610.28,4610.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I think it's a good","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4611.18,4612.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e paper, you know, article, really,\nnot a paper.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4612.96,4615.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I don't quite understand why\nthat's more important than some of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4616.04,4619.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the other ones I've done.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4619.12,4620.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1262","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, obviously, the Sendmail","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4622.26,4623.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1263","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e book was a big deal at the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4623.76,4627.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1264","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It was a...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4627.54,4628.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1265","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e O'Reilly and Associates said it\nwas their best-selling book for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4629.06,4632.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1266","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e several years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4632.38,4633.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1267","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So Brian Costales was the primary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4636.5,4639.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1268","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e author on that, so I can't really\ntake the credit for that one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4639.14,4642.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1269","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4648.84,4649.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1270","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I mean, I try and do, I try and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4651.0,4656.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1271","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e feel at least not embarrassed by\nanything I publish.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4657.26,4660.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1272","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I don't know if that means\nproud.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4660.68,4663.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1273","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I guess it's more important what\nhas actually had impact and Those","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4665.94,4671.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1274","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e two things are probably the ones\nthat have had the most impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4671.28,4673.681"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1275","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So what activities have you\npursued recently?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4675.44,4679.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1276","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, well I retired from the\nuniversity in and you know really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4681.98,4689.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1277","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e retired from the university this\ntime as in, you know, I'm getting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4689.8,4692.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1278","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e a pension.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4692.62,4693.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1279","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so, you know, I still do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4695.56,4698.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1280","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e technology work and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4699.02,4702.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1281","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm a wine collector.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4702.36,4703.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1282","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I built a database to store\nthe inventory of our wine cellar.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4704.32,4709.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1283","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that's all in Python, which\nwas a language I had to learn in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4710.86,4715.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e order to do this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4715.08,4716.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I'm kind of the default system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4718.48,4720.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1286","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e administrator for the house, which\nI kind of hate, but somebody has","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4720.58,4726.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1287","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4726.88,4727.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1288","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I got involved in a place called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4729.34,4732.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1289","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the Hillside, Berkeley Hillside\nClub, several years ago,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4732.04,4735.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1290","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e originally just as a member.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4736.32,4737.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1291","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Hillside Club is a member","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4738.84,4741.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e organization focusing on basically\nart, architecture, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4741.16,4748.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e certain current event things,\nclimate change, et cetera.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4748.94,4754.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And at some point ended up, I\ndidn't get out of the way fast","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4758.52,4764.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e enough and I ended up being\nelected to the board.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4764.16,4766.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I just literally a few days\nago, turned out and I ultimately","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4767.88,4773.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e ended up as President.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4773.76,4775.063"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1298","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I'm this President for two","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4776.82,4779.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1299","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e years and I'm gratified that many\npeople have told me that I was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4779.86,4785.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1300","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e actually a good President.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4785.34,4786.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1301","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I almost feel like now that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4786.72,4788.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1302","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I've retired, I may have gotten\nthis management thing working.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4788.84,4792.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1303","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And actually after swearing I\nwould never start another company","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4798.24,4801.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e again in my life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4801.72,4802.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I started another company called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4802.64,4805.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the, it's a not-for-profit called\nthe Berkeley Historic Building","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4805.14,4809.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Fund.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4809.02,4809.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it's to collect money to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4811.12,4814.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e maintain historic buildings,\nincluding the building that the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4814.84,4818.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Hillside Club is in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4818.6,4820.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So we are interested in getting a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4821.34,4824.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e new roof and things like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4824.96,4826.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I'm kind of doing, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4826.92,4830.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e more social things now, not so\nmuch serious tech.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4830.32,4834.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, let's go back to many years\nago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4837.42,4842.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So In 1976, you came out of the\ncloset.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4843.38,4847.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e You already mentioned your\npartner.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4848.48,4850.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e But what I wanted to ask you is,\nwhat happened in 1976?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4850.9,4856.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e How you did it and what was its\nimpact in those days, in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4856.98,4861.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e mid-70s?\nI was in an emotionally very, very","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4861.64,4870.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e bad way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4870.16,4870.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I won't go into the gory details,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4871.12,4872.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1323","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e but it became very clear to me\nthat I had to come out and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4873.08,4880.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1324","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e didn't even want to consider the\nalternative.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4880.6,4882.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1325","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that was probably the best\ndecision I've ever made in my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4886.76,4893.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1326","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4893.84,4894.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I lost some friends.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4897.74,4899.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, when I came out of the\ncloset, I didn't just like open","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4901.24,4906.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1329","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the door, I used dynamite to blow\nit open.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4906.24,4909.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1330","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I was working on the Ingress\nProject back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4910.46,4913.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And there were some people who\nwere clearly concerned about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4913.04,4920.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But a whole bunch of the other\npeople were like, yay for you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4920.78,4926.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And some of those people remained\nsome of my best friends.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4927.08,4929.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But more importantly, I think I\nmentioned kind of an angry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4931.76,4938.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e personality for a while.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4938.74,4940.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, some of that was, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4942.04,4944.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e know, frankly, I got some of it\nfrom my father, but a lot of it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4944.52,4950.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was just pent up, you know,\nself-hatred, I guess.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4950.44,4954.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that let me open up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4955.66,4961.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, You know, like I said, there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4965.48,4967.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e were people who, you know, I lost,\nbut it gave me a path to being an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4967.38,4977.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e easier to get along with person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4977.5,4979.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1343","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so I think it, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4981.38,4983.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1344","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e completely changed my personality.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4983.22,4984.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm much less of an asshole than I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4985.66,4987.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was before.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4987.54,4988.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, I did at some point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4990.84,4994.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e meet a guy who was actually a\nstudent at Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4995.78,5000.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1349","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I was still on the Ingress\nproject, but I was out at that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5000.44,5004.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1350","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e point and at the time he was in\nthe closet and so it didn't go","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5004.72,5011.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1351","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e well and for a couple of years if\nwe saw each other in the hallway,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5011.56,5017.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1352","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e we'd both turn around and walk the\nother direction.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5017.64,5019.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1353","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But then went to a gay students\nunion meeting once, which I almost","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5021.6,5028.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1354","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e never did, but I did that day and\nwho would be in the room but the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5028.64,5032.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e same guy, tried to hide behind a\npillow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5032.8,5035.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And we've been together ever\nsince, 44 years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5037.12,5040.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So in 1998, you said in an\ninterview, there is some sort of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5042.26,5049.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e perverse pleasure in knowing that\nit's basically impossible to send","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5049.06,5054.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e a piece of hate mail out through\nthe internet without...(voice gets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5054.54,5058.785"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e cut) Yeah, that was a period where\nthere was a lot of sort of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5058.785,5074.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Christian fundamentalism that\nsomehow was sneaking into the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5074.02,5077.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e technology world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5077.08,5078.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1363","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Somebody was proposing a new","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5078.94,5082.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1364","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e version of Unix called Yazix, I\nthink.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5082.28,5086.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And you know, there would be no\nkill command because you know to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5087.38,5091.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e kill as a sin so they renamed that\nand they obviously they had to get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5091.3,5095.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e rid of some mail because it was\nwritten by what do they say a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5095.32,5100.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e well-known gay activist or\nsomething like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5100.48,5104.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I don't remember exactly what it\nwas.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5104.76,5106.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I can't even remember when or\nwhere I said that or to whom, But","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5108.74,5115.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it was just kind of an offhanded,\nyou know, aside.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5116.26,5120.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And Sendmail survived and Yazix or\nwhatever they were calling it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5123.5,5127.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e didn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5127.72,5128.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I win.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5128.44,5130.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Would you like to say anything\nelse about your husband?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5136.36,5139.875"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Sure, Kirk McKusick, another kind\nof luminary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5143.02,5147.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I know you've interviewed him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5147.3,5148.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He shared an office with Bill Joy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5150.64,5153.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e so I knew Bill pretty well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5154.52,5156.394"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He's one of those people he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5156.394,5164.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Actually what he it's PhD was in\ntable driven register allocation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5165.4,5171.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e for compilers, something like\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5171.84,5174.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Something that he has used, I\nthink, once in his career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5175.06,5178.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Although it turns out that his PhD\nthesis is now referenced by a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5179.7,5185.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e bunch of people because as\ncomputers get to the point where","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5185.12,5188.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e they have more and more registers,\nthe algorithms that he came up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5188.04,5192.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e with are completely the right\nthings, but that's not what he's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5192.78,5195.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e working on He started working on\nthe file system for Unix.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5195.38,5198.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Once again, Bill Joy saying \"hey\nKirk, you know, why don't you work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5198.44,5203.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e on this?\" and Bill was really good\nat getting other people to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5203.42,5210.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5210.16,5210.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And he wrote what was called at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5212.76,5216.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the time the FAST file system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5216.26,5218.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's now been renamed UFS, the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5218.68,5221.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Unix file system, because it's\nessentially the default Unix file","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5221.5,5226.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e system for everyone.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5226.06,5227.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But he's kept on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5230.52,5232.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And he has added all kinds of\nstuff, Background FSCK, for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5232.86,5243.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e example, so you didn't have to\nwait forever for the system to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5243.26,5247.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e reboot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5247.04,5247.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And snapshots, so you could get a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5248.86,5251.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e backup of a clean file system that\nwasn't changing out from under you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5251.62,5256.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e and and and and and and.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5256.04,5258.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He's done recently a bunch of work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5258.8,5263.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e for Netflix, kind of\ncounterintuitive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5263.38,5267.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Netflix uses this file system to\ndistribute the actual movies that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5268.66,5275.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e are on the internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5276.32,5277.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the discs that they use, every","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5280.4,5283.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e day they rewrite them in the\nmiddle of the night predicting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5283.14,5286.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e what is going to be valuable the\nnext day and so if a disc dies we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5286.44,5292.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e have as many discs as Netflix does\nthere's always a dead disc They","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5292.7,5297.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e didn't want the whole system to\ncrash.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5297.32,5299.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e They just wanted the system to\nsay, oh, that disk went away,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5299.12,5302.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e okay, I'll just skip over that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5302.66,5305.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so they actually paid him to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5305.76,5308.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e do that work on the condition that\nit go into the open source.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5308.94,5312.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So the whole world benefits from\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5313.26,5316.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So yeah, he's still working on\nfile systems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5316.92,5319.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Have you ever worked together or\ncollaborated on a project?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5321.72,5325.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, many of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5331.54,5333.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, I kind of worked on Trek","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5334.52,5336.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e with Steve, Steve Warren.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5336.6,5342.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The ADIT project had multiple","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5348.42,5352.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e programmers on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5352.44,5353.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There was one guy in particular,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5353.52,5354.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e uh, who, uh, kind of, we did kind\nof co-coding for big chunks of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5355.9,5364.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So we'd actually go into the\noffice at night when we wouldn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5364.96,5368.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e get interrupted and spend all\nnight, you know, two computers in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5368.0,5372.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the office and working on the\ncode, handing stuff back and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5372.78,5378.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5378.26,5378.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yeah, there's been lots of people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5382.04,5383.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e who I've done some kind of work\nwith.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5384.04,5387.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That experience with the, with,\num, at Britain Lee was probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5388.82,5394.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the tightest I've ever worked with\nanyone before.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5395.0,5397.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Others have been, you know, the\nsurgical team model where there's,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5399.54,5407.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you know, one guy in charge and\nother people who are scattered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5407.3,5411.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e around the side.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5411.48,5412.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Husband?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5417.32,5417.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e With Kirk?\nOne thing about a successful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5419.94,5424.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e relationship is it may be\nimportant to not work too","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5424.52,5427.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e intimately on projects.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5427.62,5429.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e There's a lot of stuff we've done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5430.52,5432.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e together, you know, carpentry\naround the house and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5432.02,5435.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But it's like cooking together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5436.16,5437.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e We learned a long time ago that we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5438.24,5440.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e can cook together as long as we\nknow who's making dinner and who's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5440.38,5444.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e helping.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5444.72,5445.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And it trades off which is which.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5446.28,5448.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Doesn't really matter, it's not\nlike one of us has to be in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5449.3,5452.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e control all the time, but if we\ntry and negotiate everything, it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5452.8,5460.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e can be a problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5460.14,5461.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Bigly I agree with you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5462.86,5464.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So, what is your main motivation\nin supporting free and open source","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5464.96,5473.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e software?\nYou know, if I'm going to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5473.58,5484.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e gallant, I'll make some comment\nabout making the world a better","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5484.72,5488.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e place, etc., etc. If I'm going to\nbe a little more honest, I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5488.82,5492.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it's just because I really love it\nwhen people use the stuff I've","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5492.12,5495.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e written.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5495.86,5496.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the easiest way to do that is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5497.5,5499.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to give it away.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5499.14,5500.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I have, my whole career, I have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5501.32,5506.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e not gone for the jobs that make\nthe most money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5506.82,5509.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I've gone to the jobs that most\ninterest me, you know, and assumed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5510.02,5514.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e that the money would sort of\nfollow along.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5515.02,5518.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And, you know, I could be way, way\nricher than I am right now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5518.08,5522.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But why?\nI've got enough money that I can","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5523.74,5528.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e retire comfortably, and I can't\nbuy islands or fly private jets or","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5528.36,5533.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e anything like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5533.78,5534.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I'm happy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5536.0,5536.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And so, yeah, just having people\nuse the work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5537.6,5544.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I love it when somebody\ncomes up and says, oh, I use, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5544.1,5549.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e know, whatever, Sendmail,\nwhatever, and you know, I loved","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5549.06,5552.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5552.44,5552.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That just makes me all warm","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5554.46,5555.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e inside.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5555.88,5556.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e So if you look at your life, what","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5558.4,5560.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e is the thing you're the most proud\nof?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5560.4,5564.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Most proud of in my life, it's,\nI'm tempted to say coming out of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5572.7,5576.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e the closet because it made my life\na lot better and frankly the lives","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5576.88,5583.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e of other people around me a lot\nbetter.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5583.28,5585.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e SendMail obviously had an\nincredible impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5587.94,5590.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e SendMail is still out there on the\ninternet but it's nowhere near the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5590.84,5596.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e market share that it used to have.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5596.9,5598.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e That's okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5598.56,5599.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Syslog turned out to be really,\nreally important.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5599.74,5603.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And once again, it's been\nrewritten.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5604.1,5605.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's not my code anymore, but it\nwas my idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5605.52,5608.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, the environment at the\ncomputer science department at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5612.3,5616.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Berkeley, where I had something to\ndo with building it, I'm really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5616.72,5621.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e proud of.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5621.92,5622.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It really improved the ability for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5624.22,5628.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e researchers to get their jobs done\nacross the entire department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5628.34,5631.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It wasn't just my group, it was\nthe whole department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5631.38,5634.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that's really pretty cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5635.68,5637.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, the honors and stuff","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5641.22,5642.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e don't mean that much to me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5644.4,5645.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know, I mean, it's nice to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5646.04,5647.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e recognized, but it's not like I,\nyou know, have plaques all around","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5647.58,5653.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1499","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e my office, you know, showing off\nthe awards that I've gotten.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5653.32,5657.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1500","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I think that's tacky.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5657.58,5658.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e What advice would you give to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5664.56,5666.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e someone willing to pursue a career\ntoday?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5666.18,5669.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Well, it depends on what your\ngoals in life are, I guess.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5676.54,5679.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Like it's said, I've done the bit\nof going on and doing whole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5681.28,5689.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e bunches of different things, which\nmeans I've learned a lot, means","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5689.54,5692.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm probably never the best at\nanything at any given time because","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5692.76,5697.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I'm the one who's learning about\nit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5697.92,5700.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But there's a famous guy, won the\nTuring Award, Jim Gray, who sadly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5701.3,5709.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e was lost at sea several years ago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5710.32,5712.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And Jim was a friend of mine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5712.88,5714.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And his thing was doing massive\ndatabases.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5715.44,5719.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And he would pick something that\nhad never been done before and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5721.04,5725.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e then do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5726.26,5727.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And these things were earth","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5728.12,5732.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e changing, in some senses quite\nliterally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5732.04,5734.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Maps, the database technology that\nwe have to store maps that you use","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5734.62,5740.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e from everyone today was developed\nby Jim.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5740.4,5744.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And the thing about Jim was he,\nwhen he went into a new thing, he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5745.72,5751.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e didn't just say, okay, what's the,\nwhat do I as a computer scientist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5751.44,5755.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e need to know?\nHe said he wants to understand the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5756.0,5759.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e technology or the science that is\napplied.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5759.54,5764.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So his last project was working on\nthe sky map, said, you know, well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5765.08,5771.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e what's bigger than the whole\nplanet?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5771.04,5772.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Oh, how about the whole universe?\nAnd when he was honored after he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5772.74,5781.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e passed away, somebody on that\nproject said, Jim came in and he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5781.22,5786.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e said, I want to learn about\nastronomy, not what's your data","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5786.58,5789.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5789.98,5790.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e He said, I want to understand","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5790.42,5791.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e astronomy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5791.92,5792.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And he started actually making","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5792.56,5794.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e serious contributions to the\nproject.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5794.3,5796.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e I think that's great.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5799.52,5800.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And if you can do it, that's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5800.76,5804.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e wonderful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5804.02,5804.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I remember chatting with him","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5804.54,5808.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e at some point, and he was working\nat Microsoft, and he said, they're","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5808.0,5812.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e paying me an obscene amount of\nmoney for work that I would","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5812.12,5816.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e happily do for free if they just\ngave me the resources to do it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5816.46,5821.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e with.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5821.12,5821.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e This was a perfect life and so if","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5822.64,5825.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e you can get the perfect life, go\nfor it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5825.02,5827.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e You know other people like Kirk\nare very happy to you know kind of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5828.8,5833.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e carve out this area and you know\nif you carve out an area don't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5833.82,5837.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e make it too small don't make it\ntoo big.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5837.8,5840.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, yeah, I would definitely say\nyou know followed the interest","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5846.84,5852.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e don't follow the money obviously,\nwe need enough to be able to put","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5852.94,5858.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e food in the refrigerator and so\nforth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5858.86,5861.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I think a lot of people going\ninto deep learning AI today are","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5864.76,5870.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e doing it because they think\nthere's, data scientists are going","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5870.68,5876.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e to make a huge amount of money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5876.84,5878.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that's true, some of them","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5879.06,5880.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e will, but there's so many people\ngoing into it right now that there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5880.66,5884.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e will be a glut of data scientists\nin a few years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5884.24,5887.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I did neural networks when\nneural networks were out of favor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5891.04,5895.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And I kind of like doing stuff\nthat is not popular and having it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5898.24,5903.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e become popular later.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5903.16,5904.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e The database interfaces, graphical","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5905.68,5908.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e database interfaces that I\nmentioned earlier, you know, three","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5908.84,5912.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e years later that's what everyone\nwanted.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5912.26,5915.361"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e And that VP of marketing was an\nidiot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5916.42,5918.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So, do something exciting, do\nsomething that's challenging, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5921.82,5931.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e enjoy it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5931.58,5932.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Is there anything you would like","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5936.04,5937.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e to add that you haven't covered\ntoday?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5937.84,5940.059"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Probably tons of things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5940.059,5942.61"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e But I was thinking of something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5942.61,5953.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e earlier, but I've lost it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5953.94,5955.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e So I'm just going to say no. Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5955.1,5959.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e We can cover this in another\ninterview, perhaps?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5960.2,5963.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Maybe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5964.56,5965.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Okay, so thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5968.18,5970.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e It's been a real pleasure talking\nto you today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5970.78,5974.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e Yes, it's been a pleasure talking\nwith you too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5975.02,5977.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Eric Allman:\u003c/strong\u003e It's kind of fun to reminisce.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5977.12,5978.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"\u003cstrong\u003e Elisabetta Mori:\u003c/strong\u003e Thank you very much.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5985.94,5986.17"}]},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["English [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49302/annotation/1576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"subtitling","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/049/302/original/transcript_speakers.vtt?1693282225","format":"text/vtt","language":"en"},"target":"https://d9jk7wjtjpu5g.cloudfront.net/file_transcripts/associated_files/000/049/302/original/transcript_speakers.vtt?1693282225"}]},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303","type":"AnnotationPage","label":{"en":["TheirStory Transcript (VTT) [Transcript]"]},"items":[{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Welcome to FOSSDA, the Free and\nOpen Source Stories Digital","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5.22,9.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Archive Foundation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=9.14,10.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's the 6th of June, 2023, and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=11.92,14.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"am Elisabetta Mori, a historian of\ncomputing currently based in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=14.86,18.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Italy, and an oral history\ninterviewer with FOSSDA.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=18.92,23.241"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Today, I'll be talking to software\nengineer, Eric Allman, author of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=24.48,28.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the mail transfer agent, Sendmail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=28.74,30.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We are recording on TheirStory.io,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=31.98,33.978"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I am in Rio, in Elba, in Elba\nIsland, Italy, and Eric is in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=34.84,41.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Berkeley, California.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=41.04,42.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Welcome, Eric.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=43.48,44.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=45.54,45.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you for being here today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=45.56,48.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Where and when were you born?\nI was born in Oakland, which is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=50.6,58.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the next town over from Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=58.26,59.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And back in 1955, which I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=63.38,67.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sometimes wonder how old I'm\ngetting to be now, and moved when","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=67.48,75.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was about two and a half, three\nmaybe, to El Cerrito, which is a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=75.38,80.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"town on the other side of\nBerkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=80.02,81.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then at some point I moved\ninto Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=82.0,85.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I've been, I think of myself as\na Berkeley boy through.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=85.16,88.29"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hello?\nYes, hi.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=88.29,103.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We had a glitch there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=103.58,105.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=105.54,106.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, can you describe your parents?\nSure, my mother was a basically","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=107.02,119.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"spent her life in education.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=119.5,120.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"She was a school teacher","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=121.22,124.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"originally in the Head Start\nprogram and later became a regular","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=125.02,133.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"classroom teacher and at some\npoint got her master's degree and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=133.26,138.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"moved up to the principal role,\nwhich she did for the rest of her","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=139.14,142.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=142.44,142.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My father was, when I was born,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=145.64,148.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was an adman for the Richmond\nIndependent, which was a local","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=148.08,153.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"paper, long gone now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=153.46,155.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at some point he and my mother","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=158.76,161.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"divorced, and so I'm not as\ncompletely clear about what he was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=161.28,167.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"doing after that, but he stayed in\nadvertising for a while and wrote","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=167.04,172.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a newspaper column called Art Who,\nwhich was an art critic column,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=172.8,183.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and at some point kind of retired\nand was at that point just sort of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=183.64,190.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"an art collector.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=190.9,192.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh, we did art brokering for a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=192.44,194.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"while too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=194.26,195.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And my mother passed away a couple","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=200.08,202.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"years ago, and my father, actually\nmy mother passed away about five","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=202.58,208.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"years ago, and my father passed\naway about two years ago, maybe","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=208.08,213.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"three.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=213.28,213.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm sorry.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=214.28,215.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What about your siblings?\nI have one sister, Kat, who...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=219.3,226.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How can I put this?\nMy sister was, you know, if I was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=231.68,235.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the kind of mathematical one in\nthe family, she was the, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=235.32,239.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"humanities person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=239.16,240.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And she had, I think, a difficult","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=241.74,247.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"time because I was considered to\nbe the great student and she","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=247.58,253.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"always felt like she was in my\nshadow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=253.74,255.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what's happened is, in fact,\nshe ended up going to work at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=255.7,259.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Google very early on doing open\nsource developer relations and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=259.8,271.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"don't know I think she was there\n15 years, which is pretty amazing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=271.5,276.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and she's recently left and I\nthink she's still contemplating","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=276.82,281.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whether she wants to retire or you\nknow go for another job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=281.82,285.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What was your family life like?\nMy family life?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=288.68,292.654"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, as I mentioned my parents\ngot divorced when I was quite","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=293.42,297.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"young.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=297.8,298.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I came from what they used","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=299.24,303.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to call back then a broken family,\nalthough I don't think there was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=303.22,307.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anything particularly broken about\nit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=307.0,308.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My mother was an absolutely\nwonderful mother who, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=308.88,312.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was at one point going to school,\nhad a full time job and raising","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=312.84,316.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"two kids by herself and never\nseemed to break a sweat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=316.48,322.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was quite astounding.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=322.0,324.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"When she was going to school, my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=327.72,329.772"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sister and I would sometimes,\nactually most of the time, spend","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=331.08,334.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"summers at my grandparents' place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=334.2,335.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That would be her parents.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=335.86,337.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And they lived out in the country\nin Sebastopol.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=338.42,341.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So there was a, what was it,\n12-acre, I think, forest to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=342.74,349.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"explore and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=349.54,351.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, you know, not a bad way to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=351.26,352.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"spend your summers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=352.7,353.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"A little lonely, I guess, because","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=354.14,355.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they were down at the end of a\ndirt road and there just weren't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=355.84,358.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anyone my age around.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=358.38,359.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But that was fairly informative,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=362.86,365.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=365.94,366.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So which schools did you attend","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=368.6,370.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and what were your favorite\nsubjects?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=370.84,372.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'll skip kindergarten.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=375.271,377.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I went to actually a couple of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=380.24,387.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"different, we called them junior\nhigh schools.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=387.98,391.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They're called middle schools now\nand then I ended up at El Cerrito","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=391.72,394.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"High School which might as I've\nalready intimated my specialties","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=394.78,407.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seem to be like math and science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=407.38,409.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"No particularly great surprise,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=411.02,412.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but, you know, I did other things\ntoo.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=413.2,420.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In high school, at, I think my\nsister's suggestion, I got","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=420.18,424.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"involved doing work in the\ntheater, which was a really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=424.54,429.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"astounding thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=429.32,430.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I did sound, and making sound","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=430.68,435.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"effects was quite interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=435.1,439.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At one point I had to make the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=439.82,441.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sound of a train crash.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=441.2,442.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That was fun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=443.6,444.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How did you do it?\nI went into the theater when no","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=445.38,449.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one was around and laid a ladder\non the stage, piled chairs on top","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=449.9,457.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of the ladder, tied a rope around\nthe ladder and pulled the whole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=457.12,460.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"thing onto the ground.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=460.28,461.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think I then, you know, slowed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=464.24,466.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it down or something like that a\nlittle bit and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=466.46,470.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was pretty cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=471.4,472.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1685","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So let's talk about university.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=474.48,476.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You went to University of\nCalifornia, Berkeley in 1973?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=477.72,483.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=484.54,485.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you got a Bachelor in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=485.8,487.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Electronic Engineering and\nComputer Science in 1977 and a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=487.16,492.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Master of Science in Computer\nScience in June 1980.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=492.04,495.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what are your memories of those\nyears?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=497.22,500.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was not a particularly happy kid\nin high school.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=506.04,509.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I did well in classes\nand so forth, but I never really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=510.58,514.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"felt connected to my peers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=514.64,517.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think part of that, in fact, I'm","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=517.4,519.559"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sure part of it was, you know, by\nhigh school I had realized that I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=519.559,524.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was gay, but I was still very much\nin the closet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=524.54,527.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And attitudes then were not as\nforgiving as they are today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=527.9,536.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so, I kind of started over\nfrom scratch when I went to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=538.36,543.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=543.04,543.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I have only kept in touch with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=545.02,548.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a couple of people from my high\nschool days.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=548.08,550.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The Berkeley was great for me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=557.72,560.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It helped that I had no social","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=561.9,563.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"life because that way I could do\nall of my homework.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=563.64,566.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And remember, you know, physics\nproblem set was all day Saturday","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=566.58,571.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and math problem set was all day\nSunday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=571.76,575.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, and I was taking computer\nclasses.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=578.94,582.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So back in high school, actually\nin junior high school, there was a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=583.08,588.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"teacher, I guess a math teacher at\na different school when I was in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=588.62,593.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who decided it would be cool to do\nan after-school program teaching","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=593.24,598.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"kids how to program, Fortran to be\nprecise.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=598.28,602.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I got involved with that and\nlearned Fortran.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=603.44,610.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I already knew some computer\nlanguages when I got into","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=610.08,613.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Berkeley, which gave me a definite\nleg up because, you know, it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=613.5,621.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"wasn't like today where everyone\nlearns coding in, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=621.66,624.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"elementary schools.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=624.72,625.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So.. so was there any particular","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=628.14,630.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"reason why you chose Berkeley?\nYou know, when I was a little kid,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=631.08,641.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"my parents would take me over to\ncampus and I would play in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=643.86,647.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Strawberry Creek.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=647.56,648.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, Berkeley campus was just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=650.74,653.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sort of part of my life and always\nhad been.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=653.12,655.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I can't even remember if I\neven applied to any other schools.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=657.04,660.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It just, it seemed like the\nobvious thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=661.98,664.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There were other practical issues.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=664.3,666.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"My mother was still a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=667.36,668.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"schoolteacher at that point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=668.56,669.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, frankly, we didn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=669.92,672.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"make very much money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=672.4,673.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so this way I could live at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=675.48,676.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"home, commute into campus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=676.96,679.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so combination of good school,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=681.16,686.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"familiar place, money, And I don't\nknow, it just, it's always felt","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=686.98,694.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=694.08,694.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's, you know, fairly obscure,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=696.94,698.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I guess, but, you know, the\ncomputer science at Berkeley,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=698.56,701.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"computer science department\nexisted, but it wasn't the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=702.38,705.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"powerhouse that it is today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=705.14,706.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it wasn't like I was going, oh","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=706.78,708.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's the best school in the\ncountry for it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=708.34,710.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It probably is today, but not\nthen.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=711.76,714.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Was there any particular episode\nthat you remember from those","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=717.34,723.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"years?\nMany of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=723.34,726.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was a pretty obnoxious kid back\nthen.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=730.38,734.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, dealing with all this\nemotional stuff going on with 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I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=756.98,761.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"would interrupt the professor and\npoint out his mistake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=761.52,765.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That did not endear me to people,\nbut it did give me a reputation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=766.14,770.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at some point there was a\nbrand new research project called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=771.82,779.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Ingress Project Interactive\nGraphics and Retrieval System,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=779.9,783.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which was actually a database\nmanagement system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=784.86,787.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It wasn't in the name.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=787.74,788.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was one of the first","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=789.92,791.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"relational databases 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relational\ndatabases.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=795.66,797.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"One of them was Ingress at\nBerkeley and the other was System","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=797.72,801.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"R from IBM and San Jose.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=801.56,803.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so Mike Stonebreaker, who was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=805.68,809.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the PI, principal investigator on\nIngress, You know, I guess","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=809.48,817.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually he was supposed to be my\nundergrad advisor as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=817.3,820.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anyway, he suggested that I might\ncome up, come in as a part-time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=820.44,824.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Senior Engineering Aid was I think\nthe title, which, you know, I got","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=828.52,834.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"paid, which seemed like an immense\namount of money because I never","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=834.24,838.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"had any money before then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=838.32,839.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was, you know, probably $800 a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=839.86,842.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"month or something like that, but\nit was greater than zero.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=842.78,846.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I ended up being dropped\ninto a grad school setting when I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=854.54,860.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was a sophomore and that\ndefinitely changed my life that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=860.32,868.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was an amazing experience and I\ncan probably tell stories for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=868.38,873.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hours about that, but I won't bore\nyou.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=873.62,876.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just tell one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=878.4,879.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sorry?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=880.52,881.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just tell one, Ben.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=881.38,882.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Just one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=883.9,884.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Part of the thing that was\ninteresting about the Ingress","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=895.76,898.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"project is we were doing some\nreally cutting edge research.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=898.3,901.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was also pretty laid back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=902.26,904.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so people would be, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=905.9,910.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have other side projects that they\nwere doing, and I had a bunch of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=910.12,913.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"side projects, some of which I've\nbecome quite well known for.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=913.48,916.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that freedom allowed me to\nexplore a lot of things that I, if","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=917.78,932.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was just, you know, in the\nstandard undergraduate program, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=932.02,935.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"never would have been exposed to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=935.28,936.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the other thing was the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=938.86,940.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ingress project was working on\nUnix, which was, I think, Unix,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=940.46,944.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"when I first started, it was Unix\nversion 4.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=944.8,947.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And quickly it went up to 5\nversion 5 and then version 6 for a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=951.04,955.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"long time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=955.26,956.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I got to kind of, ride the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=956.4,959.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Unix wave at the same time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=959.16,961.914"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that was also a growth","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=963.76,968.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"experience and I started going to\nyouth conferences and met a lot of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=968.2,973.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=973.62,974.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, you know, serendipitous.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=975.38,977.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, during the years at Berkeley,\nyou worked on Ingress Project, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=980.94,990.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"also in the early 1980s, you\ndesigned DeliverMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=990.22,994.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you tell us about it?\nYes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=995.58,999.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the Ingress Project at some\npoint got a DARPA grant- Defense","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1000.48,1006.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Advanced Research Projects Agency,\nwhich meant we had a link to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1006.4,1011.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ARPANET.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1011.62,1012.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The ARPANET is the network that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1012.4,1015.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"existed before the internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1015.08,1016.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was a small network, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1018.2,1022.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"know, a couple hundred machines on\nthe entire network, couldn't grow","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1022.76,1027.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"any larger than that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1027.44,1028.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But there was enough going on that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1030.68,1033.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"everyone in the department wanted\nan account on our machines so that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1033.26,1038.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they could connect to the network.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1038.0,1039.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, um, we didn't have a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1042.2,1045.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"particularly big machine because,\nyou know, we didn't have a massive","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1045.96,1050.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"brand.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1050.2,1050.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we said, okay, we can free up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1054.54,1057.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"two RS-232 ports, just a simple\ntext only way to connect to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1057.34,1067.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1067.6,1068.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And since these ports cost, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1069.2,1071.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"know, 500 bucks a piece or\nwhatever, it was just..we told","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1071.78,1075.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"other people if you want more you\ncan pay for it yourself,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1075.6,1078.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1823","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"basically.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1078.62,1079.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1824","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And nobody wanted to pay for it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1080.18,1081.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"themselves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1081.72,1082.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So there were two ports being","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1082.22,1084.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"shared by the entire department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1084.74,1086.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you can imagine this got into","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1090.08,1092.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some uncomfortable situation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1096.02,1097.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at that point, I was already","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1098.58,1100.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"sort of the main system\nadministrator for that machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1100.6,1104.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I was, of course, the\nperson they complained to.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1104.8,1108.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And usually, of course, they\ncouldn't do anything about it, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1109.44,1113.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they complained to me anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1113.64,1115.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at some point, I made the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1115.5,1116.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"observation that what most people\nwanted access to was email.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1116.84,1125.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now, it turns out we already had\na- another very slow, also","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1126.5,1132.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"terminal-based network called\nBirknet, which was a project done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1135.06,1141.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"by a guy named Eric Schmidt, who\nlater became CEO of Google.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1141.86,1146.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I worked with Eric.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1146.88,1148.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it would send mail, but only","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1150.84,1154.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"inside the campus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1154.44,1155.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It wouldn't go out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1155.32,1156.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And similarly, mail from ARPANET\nwouldn't go to another machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1158.06,1162.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1845","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I said, you know, Birknet\nis software, ARPANET is software,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1162.5,1169.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1846","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and I know how to write software.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1169.64,1171.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'll bet I can find some way to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1171.4,1173.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"glue these things together so you\ncan get your email on your home","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1173.28,1178.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"machine, not on your machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1178.48,1181.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that was a quick hack called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1183.08,1187.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1851","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"DeliverMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1187.04,1187.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1852","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I won't say it worked well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1189.12,1191.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it did work and so I basically\nwrote Deliver Mail to get people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1191.94,1198.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to stop bothering me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1198.98,1199.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you describe Eric Schmidt?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1206.82,1208.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Eric was driven.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1212.82,1213.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I think we all you know","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1216.88,1219.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all the students kind of knew that\nEric was going to be CEO of a big","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1219.12,1223.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1859","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company someday because, you know,\nhe got a dual major in business","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1223.0,1227.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1860","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and computer science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1227.18,1228.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1861","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, I got along with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1231.36,1233.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1862","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Eric, but he could be a pain in\nthe butt sometimes, actually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1233.54,1238.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1863","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"On the other hand, I could too, so\nit was only fair.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1239.24,1242.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1864","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But yeah, he, I mean, I think\ngenuinely he was, he had in his","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1245.46,1251.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1865","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"head that he was going to be CEO\nof a major corporation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1251.86,1254.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1866","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He just focused his entire life on\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1255.64,1258.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1867","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he succeeded.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1259.48,1260.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1868","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay, let's go back to your life","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1262.9,1266.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1869","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1266.34,1267.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1870","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what about SendMail?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1267.72,1270.009"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1871","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay, so one of the superstars at\nBerkeley was a guy named Bill Joy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1272.38,1276.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1872","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, um, Bill Joy at some point\ndid a, uh, distribution.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1278.24,1284.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1873","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So back then it was kind of,\nsuppose you'd call it early days","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1286.52,1292.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1874","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of what we call open source\nsoftware.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1292.4,1294.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1875","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It wasn't really because there was\nopen source software back in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1294.76,1297.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1876","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"50s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1297.68,1298.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1877","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The IBM share conference was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1298.16,1300.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1878","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"called share because it was\nspecifically about, hey, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1300.44,1304.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1879","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"here's a tape of the stuff I've\nbeen working on, give me a tape of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1304.24,1307.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1880","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what you've been working on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1307.56,1309.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1881","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So just give us a swap meet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1309.04,1311.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1882","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Usenix got to be very much like a\nswap meet as well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1312.36,1315.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1883","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there were a bunch of people\nin the area who were actively","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1315.6,1321.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1884","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"working on Unix and developing it\nand whatnot, including Bill and a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1322.08,1328.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1885","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bunch of others at Berkeley and\nTom Farran at the UC San","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1328.76,1333.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1886","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Francisco.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1333.2,1333.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1887","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so, I mean, there were some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1336.34,1340.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1888","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"really exciting meetings in Bill's\noffice sometimes where you get all","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1340.08,1344.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1889","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of these, you know, super high\npowered people hogging the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1344.76,1350.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1890","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whiteboard.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1350.92,1351.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1891","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I guess it was actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1351.4,1352.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1892","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"chalkboards back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1352.36,1353.674"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1893","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ken Thompson came out to Berkeley","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1354.66,1356.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1894","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on sabbatical for a year.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1356.74,1358.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1895","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you know, I have actually I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1358.68,1361.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1896","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have here in my desk drawer a\nlisting of the version 6 UNIX","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1361.86,1367.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1897","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"kernel hand-annotated because Ken\nactually gave a free class,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1367.64,1374.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1898","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"evening class, where he walked\nthrough the Kernel and taught","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1375.96,1379.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1899","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"everyone how it worked.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1379.54,1380.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1900","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there were, I think, maybe a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1381.38,1384.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1901","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"dozen people in the room.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1384.54,1386.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1902","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, now if you were to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1386.54,1387.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1903","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something like that, of course,\nyou have to fire the Coliseum out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1387.92,1392.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1904","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so it was a very, very\nexciting environment to be in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1393.94,1398.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1905","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, I think I may have\nlost track of the question.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1398.9,1401.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1906","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was asking you about SendMail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1403.26,1405.229"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1907","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ah, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1406.14,1406.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1908","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So Bill did Berkeley software\ndistributions.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1410.26,1412.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1909","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can't remember now second, third\nBerkeley software distribution was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1412.98,1422.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1910","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"getting to be kind of to the form\nof a whole system and at this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1422.98,1433.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1911","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"point it still required an AT\u0026T\nLicense so it wasn't really open","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1433.32,1438.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1912","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"source in the way that it is\ntoday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1438.66,1441.867"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1913","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But since everyone who was using\nUnix had to have an AT\u0026T license,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1442.92,1448.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1914","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was kind of sort of open source\nwithin that community.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1448.48,1451.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1915","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so Berkeley, so Bob Fabry, who\nwas a faculty member there,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1453.86,1461.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1916","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"started up the Computer Systems\nResearch Group, CSRG, and hired","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1461.46,1466.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1917","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Bill and a bunch of other people\nwhose names you probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1466.74,1470.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1918","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"recognize.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1470.36,1470.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1919","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And they got a grant from DARPA to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1471.88,1478.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1920","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"create the system for the\ninternet, as yet non-existent","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1478.1,1485.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1921","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1486.36,1486.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1922","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we ended up doing the TCP/IP","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1488.16,1492.187"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1923","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"stack at Berkeley, incorporating\nideas from other places.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1492.76,1496.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1924","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't want to say we did\neverything.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1496.6,1498.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1925","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We were, in fact, very open to\npicking up other people's work and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1498.94,1504.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1926","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"integrating it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1504.86,1505.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1927","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And one of the things that was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1510.36,1511.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1928","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"needed was a mail system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1511.58,1513.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1929","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the mail system for the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1514.34,1516.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1930","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"internet was completely, utterly\ndifferent than the mail system on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1516.06,1520.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1931","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the ARPANET.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1520.82,1521.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1932","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so at that point, I had done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1523.2,1525.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1933","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"deliver mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1525.46,1526.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1934","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Bill came to me and said, so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1526.32,1528.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1935","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Eric, you know more about email\nthan anyone else here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1528.44,1531.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1936","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why don't you do it?\nAt that point, I was working 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problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1539.14,1540.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1939","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I agreed to do this and if I had","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1542.04,1543.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1940","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"known how hard it was going to be\nI would never have agreed to it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1543.94,1547.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1941","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was a lot of work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1547.12,1548.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1942","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But, you know, I stuck with it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1549.54,1551.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1943","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so when, you know, on the day,\nliterally there was a day when the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1551.76,1556.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1944","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Internet got turned on, Sendmail\nwas the mail program for the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1556.82,1561.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1945","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"entire Internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1561.82,1562.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1946","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it snowballed from there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1564.4,1567.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1947","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"During those years you also\nproduced Syslog.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1572.04,1577.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1948","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ah, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1577.64,1578.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1949","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Syslog, much less exciting I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1579.62,1582.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1950","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"suppose, but arguably more\nimportant, was just a way to, for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1582.8,1591.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1951","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"various programs to write to a log\nfile to say what they're doing,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1591.56,1598.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1952","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which when you're writing programs\nthat you run them and they run and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1598.4,1603.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1953","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then they stop, you can print\nstuff out and so forth and that's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1603.86,1607.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1954","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"easy but if you're running writing\na program where it runs in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1607.28,1610.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1955","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"background and you never actually\nsee its output, it has to have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1610.94,1614.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1956","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"some place where you can figure\nout what's going on when it's not","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1614.94,1617.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1957","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"working.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1617.74,1618.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1958","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The usual thing then was you open","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1619.28,1621.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1959","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a file and write to that file.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1621.96,1627.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1960","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the file is somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1627.2,1629.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1961","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was no standard for where it\nshould be in the file system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1630.28,1633.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1962","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it would always be a, you know,\nwhere do I find the log file for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1633.68,1638.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1963","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this program?\nIt's around here somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1638.68,1640.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1964","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe I'll be in somebody's home\ndirectory for all I know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1640.66,1643.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1965","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the other thing was when you\nhave multiple writers that, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1644.8,1649.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1966","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you're writing to a log file, they\ninteract with each other and you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1649.72,1657.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1967","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"can get alphabet soup.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1657.3,1658.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1968","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I wanted a system where you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1659.02,1660.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1969","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"could send a message to a demon\nthat would look at the message and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1660.92,1666.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1970","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then take a configuration file and\ntell it where that message should","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1666.56,1672.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1971","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"be logged.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1672.26,1672.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1972","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it could be multiple places.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1673.0,1674.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1973","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that syslog is still in use.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1679.9,1682.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1974","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's been rewritten since then,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1682.32,1684.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1975","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it's still fundamentally the\nsame thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1684.08,1686.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1976","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's actually, it's an internet\nstandard now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1686.74,1689.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1977","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so maybe not the most exciting\nthing I've ever done, but possibly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1691.96,1697.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1978","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the most important or impactful\nlet me say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1697.12,1699.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1979","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What about dash MI macros?\nAh, the ME macros.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1703.08,1710.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1980","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ME macros, yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1710.78,1712.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1981","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, yeah, there was, Unix had some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1712.74,1719.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1982","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"programs for doing text\nformatting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1719.92,1722.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1983","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was one early on called\nRof, which was very simple.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1724.54,1728.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1984","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then another one came along\ncalled NROF, which was the new","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1730.74,1735.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1985","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rof.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1735.12,1735.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1986","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Rof stood for runoff.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1735.68,1737.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1987","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it was the new runoff program.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1737.82,1739.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1988","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then there was another system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1740.36,1743.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1989","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that came out compatible with NROF\nlater called TROF, which actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1743.34,1747.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1990","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"went to a photo typesetting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1747.4,1748.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1991","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the thing about NROF and TROF","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1750.12,1752.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1992","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is they were almost unusable\nwithout a macro package because it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1752.44,1757.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1993","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was a brilliant design that gave\nyou just the very barest tools you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1757.66,1765.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1994","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"needed to essentially implement\nyour own language.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1765.52,1768.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1995","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Berkeley had nRoth and I think\nactually had tRoth but it did not","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1769.68,1774.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1996","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have a macro package.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1774.96,1777.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1997","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"AT\u0026T wouldn't release that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1777.28,1779.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/1998","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I decided I was going to\nbuild one because I really 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ME","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1785.46,1790.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2001","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"macros and learned a lot about\nNROFand TROF and typesetting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1790.86,1798.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2002","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, I still have my,\nyou know, PICA ruler here and so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1798.48,1805.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2003","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"forth from when I was measuring\nstuff out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1805.84,1810.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2004","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And yeah, it got used a lot at\nBerkeley and did get distributed.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1815.36,1819.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2005","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You can still find it on pretty\nmuch any Unix distribution, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1819.54,1822.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2006","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"mostly people use other tools\ntoday.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1822.96,1825.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2007","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, you know, it was cool though.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1826.06,1830.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2008","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think the best thing about it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1830.3,1832.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2009","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was, so back then when students\nwere getting their PhDs, they had","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1832.56,1839.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2010","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to get it typed up or, you know,\nwe're starting to get to the point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1839.44,1843.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2011","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"where it's typeset.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1843.62,1844.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2012","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it goes to the something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1844.54,1849.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2013","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"graduate office.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1849.64,1850.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2014","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there's a woman there who like","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1851.18,1853.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2015","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"pulls out a ruler and makes sure\nall of the margins are exactly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1853.94,1857.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2016","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"right and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1857.62,1858.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2017","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And if they're not, she says, go","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1858.52,1861.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2018","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"away, come back when you get it\nright.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1861.06,1863.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2019","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"She was called the Dragon Lady.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1863.9,1865.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2020","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I added in a macro called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1867.42,1870.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2021","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":".th for thesis, and that just set\nall the settings right so it would","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1870.58,1875.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2022","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"get past the dragon lady.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1875.58,1877.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2023","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that made me a very popular","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1877.58,1879.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2024","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1879.16,1879.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2025","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you also wrote Trek, the Unix","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1883.4,1887.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2026","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"version of Star Trek video game.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1887.52,1889.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2027","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1890.98,1891.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2028","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's not the first Trek version,\nalthough I did make some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1892.66,1897.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2029","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"enhancements.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1897.76,1898.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2030","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was one written in, I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1898.92,1900.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2031","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was Fortran, that somehow I\ncame across.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1900.92,1905.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2032","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think I must have played it\nsomewhere at one point and said","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1906.38,1908.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2033","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this is pretty cool but it should\nrun on the computer that I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1908.94,1911.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2034","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually have access to and so I\nstarted working on writing track","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1911.82,1919.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2035","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"wasn't quite a port of the old one\nbecause I did start pretty much","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1919.24,1923.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2036","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"over from scratch and that went\non.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1923.1,1928.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2037","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I mentioned the kind of\nrelaxed environment at the Ingress","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1928.6,1932.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2038","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"project.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1932.94,1933.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2039","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was relaxed enough that at some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1934.24,1935.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2040","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"point I got involved in Trek\nduring a summer, and during the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1935.92,1941.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2041","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"summer I was paid for full-time\ninstead of part-time, and I spent","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1941.54,1946.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2042","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"basically all of my full-time work\nworking on Trek instead of on","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1946.84,1950.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2043","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Ingress, which they should never\nhave let me get away with, but it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1950.48,1954.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2044","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was fun.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1954.86,1955.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2045","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there's an interesting story","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1956.36,1957.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2046","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about Trek.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1958.16,1958.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2047","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"People were a lot more casual","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1961.98,1963.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2048","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about privacy issues back then and\nKen Thompson had root super user","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1963.7,1970.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2049","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"access to every Unix machine on\ncampus.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1970.9,1974.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2050","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it turns out that before he\nwent back to Bell labs, he made a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1976.64,1983.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2051","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"tape of the entire system,\nincluding all everyone's personal","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1983.04,1986.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2052","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"files and so forth and took it\nwith him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1986.86,1991.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2053","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so one day I'm working in my\noffice at Ingress.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1992.84,1997.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2054","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At that point I was, I had a\nprivate office because I was the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=1998.38,2003.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2055","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"guy who did frontline support and\ncan't remember what my title was,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2003.3,2007.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2056","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but I rated a private office and I\ngot this phone call.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2007.34,2010.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2057","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And guy comes and says, Hi, I've\nlooked at your Trek program and it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2011.8,2022.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2058","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"looks like it's not finished yet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2022.04,2024.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2059","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you abandon it?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2024.44,2025.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2060","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I went, no, I did not abandon\nit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2026.06,2030.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2061","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I didn't even know you had it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2031.06,2033.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2062","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Said, oh, well, Ken brought it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2033.04,2034.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2063","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"back from Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2034.36,2035.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2064","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I was in the middle of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2035.94,2037.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2065","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"developing it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2037.6,2038.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2066","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anyway, He and I started","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2039.54,2041.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2067","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"communicating and sharing ideas\nand so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2042.14,2045.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2068","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That guy was named Steve Dorn, who\nis known for the Bourne shell and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2045.0,2051.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2069","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"several other things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2053.08,2054.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2070","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'm still in contact with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2054.34,2056.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2071","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Steve.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2056.5,2057.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2072","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, he always called me because","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2062.02,2064.179"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2073","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was a long-distance call to New\nJersey and since he worked for the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2064.36,2068.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2074","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"phone company he got free calls\nand we had very expensive calls.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2068.9,2072.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2075","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that was the arrangement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2073.08,2074.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2076","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In 1981, you had a summer job at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2079.34,2085.219"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2077","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the International Institute for\nApplied Systems Analysis in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2085.219,2091.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2078","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Luxembourg, Austria, Europe as a\nconsultant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2091.06,2094.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2079","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Can you tell us more about this\nexperience?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2095.76,2097.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2080","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How did you get this job?\nAnd what was your impression of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2098.48,2103.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2081","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Europe in the early 80s?\nSo there was a guy who was a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2103.48,2115.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2082","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"scientist mostly working on energy\nrelated matters.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2115.08,2122.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2083","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Back before energy was a trendy\nthing to work on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2122.68,2125.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2084","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he had done stints at IASA,\nInternational Institute for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2126.16,2131.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2085","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Applied Systems Analysis, aka\nYASA.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2131.56,2134.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2086","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was a guy at YASA who\nwas trying to build a graphic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2136.66,2144.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2087","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"system that the scientists could\nuse.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2145.94,2147.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2088","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And this is in the very early days\nof graphic interfaces, uh","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2148.64,2153.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2089","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"certainly wasn't you know you go\ndown to the corner store and buy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2153.44,2156.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2090","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"yourself a Mac or anything like\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2156.32,2158.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2091","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So he had collected together all\nof this hardware and stuff to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2159.16,2163.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2092","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"build it, but they had never\ngotten it working.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2163.06,2167.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2093","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so somehow my friend Jerry was\nable to get me an invitation to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2168.3,2175.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2094","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"come to do a summer at YASA that\ntook time off from Berkeley and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2175.86,2181.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2095","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"went to build this thing called\nfeds the front-end system, zystem","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2181.36,2185.769"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2096","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I guess I don't know and I quickly\nfound out why this thing had never","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2187.8,2195.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2097","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"gotten working because every time\nI'd, you know, move forward, the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2195.84,2204.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2098","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"YASA guy would come and say, oh,\nwell, you know, you should put","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2204.28,2207.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2099","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this in, it should add this and so\nforth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2207.96,2210.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2100","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it was always like trying to do\nmore and I was just trying to get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2210.06,2214.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2101","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it to work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2214.78,2215.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2102","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so he and I ended up, I guess,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2216.4,2218.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2103","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not really getting along all that\nwell, because I said no. And I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2218.66,2225.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2104","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"said, you know, I'm going to get\nthis to work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2225.14,2227.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2105","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And by God, at the end of the\nsummer, it 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actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2234.38,2237.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2108","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"use, but it did work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2237.48,2239.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2109","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the other thing that was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2241.18,2243.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2110","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"interesting about that job was, it\nwas, the Institute itself was in a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2243.24,2252.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2111","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"palace, one of Maria Theresa's\nsummer palaces.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2252.04,2256.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2112","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And my office had been friends of\nJoseph's library and big, huge","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2258.44,2269.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2113","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"glass doors all around the outside\nof the building so I could just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2269.74,2273.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2114","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"walk through that door and I'd be\nin a I think it was 40 hectare","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2273.72,2277.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2115","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"park and wander around if I wanted\nto stop and think about something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2277.24,2282.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2116","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was a castle in the\nmiddle of the park that was built","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2282.96,2287.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2117","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for Marie Antoinette as a\ndollhouse, but, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2287.12,2291.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2118","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"life-sized dollhouse.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2291.26,2292.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2119","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"She could walk into it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2292.34,2293.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2120","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And another interesting thing\nabout YASA was it was, I think at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2297.1,2303.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2121","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that time, the only scientific\ninstitute in the world that had","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2303.04,2307.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2122","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people both from the Soviet Union\nand from Western governments.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2307.08,2312.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2123","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I got to know some of the\nSoviets there and learned that a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2313.18,2318.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2124","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"lot of the stuff I'd been taught\nin school maybe not have been","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2318.68,2321.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2125","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"completely accurate.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2321.78,2322.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2126","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like these were people who, one","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2323.06,2326.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2127","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"guy was very concerned because his\nwife had to go to the hospital and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2326.2,2330.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2128","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"she wasn't with him, she was back\nin Soviet Union.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2330.42,2334.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2129","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And just the outpouring of, you\nknow, I can't really say love, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2335.36,2343.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2130","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"concern for him, made it very\nclear to me that most people in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2343.3,2351.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2131","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Russia just want to live their\nlives kind of like we do and that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2351.24,2356.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2132","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was a good thing for me to learn.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2356.02,2361.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2133","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was a Polish guy who was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2361.62,2363.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2134","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"involved with the, what was the\nunion, solidarity.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2363.6,2368.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2135","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I actually have a solidarity union\npin around here somewhere.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2369.02,2373.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2136","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we had United Nations access,\nso I had access to the UN","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2374.94,2380.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2137","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"commissary, and everything was tax\nfree, and all over the world, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2380.32,2384.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2138","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2384.3,2385.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2139","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was just a splendid summer, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2385.06,2386.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2140","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have to say.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2386.76,2387.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2141","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was also my first time in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2388.44,2389.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2142","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Europe, and so it's been kind of\ndisappointing ever since to not be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2389.84,2394.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2143","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in something quite that exciting,\nbut I love Europe anyway.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2394.78,2398.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2144","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you travel around Europe when\nyou were there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2400.24,2403.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2145","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2404.76,2405.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2146","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"No, I did not.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2407.94,2410.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2147","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I certainly have traveled a fair\namount since, but at that point, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2411.04,2415.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2148","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"remember I was taking leave from\nwork and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2415.66,2418.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2149","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I kind of had to get back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2418.22,2420.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2150","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I was in a relationship then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2421.4,2427.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2151","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In fact, the relationship I'm\nstill in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2427.66,2429.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2152","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I wanted to get back home\nand be able to cuddle with my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2430.86,2436.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2153","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"honey.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2436.76,2437.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2154","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you were back home and in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2440.52,2446.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2155","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"November 1981, you joined Britton\nLee, Pioneering Relational","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2446.64,2453.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2156","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Database Company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2454.08,2455.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2157","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I have the feeling that some of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2456.16,2460.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2158","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"your colleagues at Berkeley\ninvited you there?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2460.92,2464.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2159","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Very true.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2465.08,2465.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2160","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes, Britton Lee was a Ingress","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2467.0,2471.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2161","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"spin-off, kind of an interesting,\nmaybe a little schizophrenic","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2471.6,2478.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2162","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2478.3,2478.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2163","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The people who founded it were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2478.94,2480.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2164","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hardware guys and so they wanted\nto build a special-purpose","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2481.16,2484.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2165","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"computer that would run database\napplications.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2484.64,2487.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2166","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And they didn't realize that the\nsecret sauce in the database","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2490.04,2495.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2167","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"system is not the hardware, it's\nthe software.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2495.08,2497.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2168","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So there was a software group in\nBerkeley, even though most of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2498.8,2503.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2169","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company was in Los Gatos.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2503.38,2505.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2170","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I got hired in initially to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2506.24,2510.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2171","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"manage the, what was called the\nhost software group, which is to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2510.56,2517.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2172","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"say the things that run on your\ncomputers that talk to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2517.6,2520.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2173","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"database computer, we call it a\ndatabase machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2520.98,2524.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2174","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Then it was really one of the\nfirst cases of client-server, so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2524.62,2529.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2175","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was really a database server,\nbut that's not what the word was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2529.02,2533.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2176","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2533.68,2534.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2177","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so all of the user interfaces","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2535.42,2538.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2178","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that people would use, which was\nmostly programmatic interfaces.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2538.74,2544.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2179","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I kind of got a group together\nAnd one of the best hires I've","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2546.16,2555.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2180","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ever made, in fact, was a guy\nnamed Greg Olson, who I'll talk","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2555.14,2560.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2181","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"about later some more.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2560.08,2561.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2182","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, we were doing some","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2562.62,2564.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2183","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"good work, But I was having, this\nwas my first management job and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2564.34,2570.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2184","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"did not particularly like\nmanagement jobs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2570.24,2572.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2185","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So at some point I went to my boss\nand I said, I wanna go back to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2572.66,2578.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2186","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"being an engineer, way better at\nit than I am being a manager.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2578.0,2581.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2187","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you know I'd like to do it\nhere and work on this stuff but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2583.24,2588.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2188","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know if you can't do that I'll\nfind another job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2588.94,2593.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2189","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And to his credit, he didn't say,\nwell, bye, see you later.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2595.3,2602.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2190","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He, in fact, did put me down to\nbeing a wine engineer again.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2603.2,2608.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2191","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And by the way, did not cut my\nsalary amazingly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2608.52,2611.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2192","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And but the flip side is he took\nthis guy, Greg Olson, who was my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2614.46,2619.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2193","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"best engineer and made him my\nboss.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2619.02,2621.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2194","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I've always wondered if he\nwasn't doing that in the hopes","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2622.4,2625.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2195","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I would find that such an\ninsult that I would quit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2625.84,2628.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2196","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Um, but in fact, Greg was the\nperfect boss.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2629.84,2633.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2197","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, like day one, he came in\nand said, Eric, you're a way","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2633.72,2637.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2198","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"better programmer than I'll ever\nbe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2637.56,2639.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2199","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So how about, you know, we kind of\ndo this together and you manage","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2640.06,2644.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2200","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the technology and I'll manage\nmanagement.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2644.94,2648.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2201","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it worked great.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2649.96,2651.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2202","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Really worked well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2652.26,2653.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2203","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I ended up doing a system there.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2654.22,2657.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2204","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Um, basically I came to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2658.92,2663.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2205","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"conclusion that it was too hard to\nbuild database applications and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2663.12,2666.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2206","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"there was no reason the database\napplication had to be really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2666.12,2668.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2207","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"difficult.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2668.94,2669.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2208","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I built a system called ADIT,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2669.44,2671.394"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2209","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Advanced Database Interface Tools,\nthat included a graphic component","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2671.56,2677.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2210","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so that you could actually do\nstuff that you couldn't do on the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2678.12,2681.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2211","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Fez system back in Austria.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2681.74,2683.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2212","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I got it to the point where it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2683.36,2685.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2213","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was prototyped.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2685.82,2687.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2214","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Still needed a lot of work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2688.94,2690.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2215","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it was getting to the point\nwhere it became clear that we were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2691.1,2694.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2216","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"going to need marketing support.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2694.44,2696.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2217","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so we did a big all day demo.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2697.3,2699.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2218","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"VP of marketing came up to\nBerkeley, we gave him, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2700.06,2705.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2219","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"this big tour, showed him all the\nstuff it could do.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2705.28,2708.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2220","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at the end of the day, he\nsaid, you know, you engineers","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2708.34,2713.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2221","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"always, you just have your heads\nin the clouds.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2713.54,2715.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2222","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"People don't want these.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2716.4,2717.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2223","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You're using Sun workstations,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2718.12,2719.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2224","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which are kind of expensive at the\ntime, I suppose.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2719.64,2722.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2225","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"People don't want workstations.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2723.0,2724.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2226","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They're way too expensive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2724.96,2726.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2227","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They want PC applications.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2726.18,2729.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2228","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They want text-only PC","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2729.34,2731.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2229","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"applications, because graphics\nwasn't big on the PC.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2731.5,2734.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2230","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And after I picked my job off the\nfloor, best I could come up with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2736.28,2744.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2231","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is they will be asking for it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2744.24,2746.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2232","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But he was like, no, no marketing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2747.5,2750.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2233","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"resources are going to go to this\nat all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2750.02,2751.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2234","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's when I realized I had\nto shut down the project, which I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2751.76,2755.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2235","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"did over, you know, sort of\ncleaned it all up, documented it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2755.92,2760.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2236","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in the hopes that somebody would\ncome along and revise it when they","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2760.06,2763.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2237","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"finally figured out what was\nimportant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2763.2,2766.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2238","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is part of the thing where\nBritton Lee was a hardware","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2766.98,2770.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2239","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company, not a software company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2770.28,2771.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2240","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What I was doing was software and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2772.16,2774.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2241","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"hence not valuable.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2774.18,2775.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2242","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I ended up meeting up with a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2777.5,2783.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2243","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"friend of mine who had been a grad\nstudent when I was at Berkeley,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2783.8,2787.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2244","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and he was working at a new place\ncalled the International Computer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2789.02,2795.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2245","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Science Institute, ICSI.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2795.6,2797.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2246","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I jumped from Britton Lee","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2800.68,2803.027"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2247","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to ICSI, which was an easy jump to\ndo because they were a block apart","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2803.66,2808.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2248","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"in Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2808.4,2809.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2249","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Didn't have to rent a truck or","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2810.74,2812.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2250","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anything.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2812.24,2812.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2251","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And am I getting too far ahead","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2814.44,2817.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2252","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"here?\nThat's perfect.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2817.1,2818.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2253","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, yeah, no. So that was in 88\nwhen you joined the speech group","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2819.16,2825.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2254","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at the International Computer\nScience Institute, right?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2825.22,2828.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2255","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sounds about right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2828.76,2829.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2256","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I have to look at my resume.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2830.44,2831.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2257","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm not very good on remembering\ndates.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2831.82,2833.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2258","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, Morgan, who was known then\njust as Morgan, his full name was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2836.18,2841.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2259","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually Nelson Morgan, had been\nworking on digital audio as a grad","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2841.22,2849.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2260","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"student in electrical engineering.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2849.84,2851.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2261","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he got his PhD and he went 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a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2922.34,2928.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2284","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"form of artificial intelligence.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2928.48,2930.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2285","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now we call them deep learning 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but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2956.46,2962.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2292","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"couldn't go to an arbitrary\nanother node so a whole bunch of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2962.2,2965.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2293","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"computers in a box and it turns\nout that was a great architecture","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2965.14,2971.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2294","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for doing neural networks and I\nwas writing software for it and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2971.92,2977.85"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2295","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually didn't stay too long at\nICSI because it turns out that my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2982.54,2988.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2296","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"job was, let's look at, you know,\neight lines of assembly language","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=2988.04,2993.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2297","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and see if we can get that down to\nseven lines of assembly 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then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3008.0,3009.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2304","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, and I get to say, I actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3009.96,3011.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2305","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"did the deep learning stuff back\nbefore it was popular, but didn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3011.98,3018.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2306","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"really spend a lot of time at it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3018.26,3020.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2307","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Nonetheless, it was fun doing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3021.34,3024.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2308","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something new.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3024.28,3024.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2309","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's been a theme through my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3024.94,3027.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2310","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3027.38,3027.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2311","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Some people say, okay, I'm going","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3028.84,3030.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2312","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to work on this, and they figure\nthat out in grad school and they","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3030.96,3034.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2313","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"spend their entire career working\non that and I'm the sort of person","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3034.0,3037.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2314","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who every five years or so gets\nbored and says I want to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3037.86,3040.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2315","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something completely different And\nthat was completely different.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3040.96,3044.743"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2316","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So in 1989 you moved back to the\nUniversity of California Berkeley","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3047.14,3051.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2317","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as the lead programmer on the\nMammoth project.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3051.74,3055.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2318","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3057.42,3057.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2319","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What was the Mammoth project?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3062.54,3063.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2320","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So Mammoth was an infrastructure\ngroup.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3065.74,3068.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2321","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"At that time, Berkeley was... if\nyou had a project where you were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3070.12,3077.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2322","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"using a computer, and at that\npoint pretty much everyone was 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software.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3088.7,3091.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2327","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was starting to become a\nproblem because two groups would","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3092.38,3096.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2328","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"talk to each other and say \"oh,\nyou know we're doing stuff 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the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3102.52,3107.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2331","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"compiler or something.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3107.8,3109.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2332","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so, um, a professor, Susan","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3110.98,3116.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2333","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Graham, um, became the PI on the\nMammoth project.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3116.74,3123.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2334","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the idea was we got an\nactually really big grant to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3123.48,3128.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2335","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"install and manage infrastructure.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3129.0,3130.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2336","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so we had a CM5 from Thinking","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3132.34,3138.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2337","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Machines, which was a parallel\ncomputer at that point, which I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3138.4,3143.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2338","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"don't quite know how they talked\nthinking machines into letting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3145.28,3149.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2339","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"them have one for a fraction of\nthe price because these things...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3149.72,3153.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2340","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so there's at the end of the rack\nthere's a panel filled with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3153.18,3162.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2341","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"blinking lights and you've seen it\nin Jurassic Park because in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3162.04,3169.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2342","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"scene where the girl goes into the\nmachine room and goes \"Oh, this 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this.\"","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3174.44,3175.767"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2345","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The machine was actually a CM5 and\nin fact the guy who maintained our","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3175.767,3182.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2346","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"machine was the one who installed\nthat on the set.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3182.78,3185.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2347","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it turns out there were no\nprocessors at all in that box.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3186.22,3190.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2348","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The lights flashing, there was a\nseparate processor just to 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was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3210.1,3213.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2355","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so heavy that it took two people\nto lift it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3213.42,3216.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2356","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was just, the machine was a\ndisaster in terms of actually","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3216.9,3222.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2357","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"being usable and maintainable and\nso forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3224.34,3227.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2358","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anyway, that was one of the\nthings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3227.92,3229.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2359","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Another one was a compute machine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3231.3,3235.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2360","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is back in the time when","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3237.06,3238.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2361","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people are starting to say maybe\nthis parallel processing stuff is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3238.38,3241.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2362","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a good 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RISC-OS.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3250.58,3251.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2365","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was a, I can't remember the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3251.92,3253.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2366","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"manufacturer now, but I think it\nwas the 32 processor system, which","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3253.32,3256.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2367","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was about the biggest you could\nget back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3256.5,3258.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2368","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the third one was a disk\nserver, which we got from another","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3260.9,3269.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2369","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3269.44,3269.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2370","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the idea was people could get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3271.0,3276.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2371","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"time, counts, whatever, on any of\nthese resources.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3276.04,3279.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2372","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that way they wouldn't have to\nmanage the machines themselves.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3280.84,3284.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2373","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So on the disk servers we built\nsomething called the software","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3286.74,3290.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2374","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"warehouse, which basically said,\nlet's find all the interesting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3290.92,3295.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2375","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"software that anyone might wanna\nuse, we'll put it in one place,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3295.58,3298.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2376","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it'll be shared through the whole\ndepartment, we will maintain it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3298.84,3302.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2377","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so all of these people who\nhave been spending all their time","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3303.26,3306.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2378","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"doing system administration can\nactually do real research.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3306.42,3309.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2379","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was incredibly successful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3310.08,3312.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2380","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at a group there, at that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3315.6,3319.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2381","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"point, I was a manager again, but\nI was getting to be better at it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3319.18,3322.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2382","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I had been in my first\nmanagement job and yeah, it was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3322.9,3330.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2383","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"kind of changed the whole culture\nin the department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3334.12,3336.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2384","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I was a very popular guy in the\ndepartment for a while.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3337.86,3341.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2385","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the problem with the mammoth\nproject is it had gotten to the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3342.18,3345.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2386","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"point where it was starting to\nbecome a, okay, just keep things","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3345.84,3349.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2387","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"running.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3349.84,3350.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2388","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so it was a maintenance job.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3351.1,3355.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2389","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I was, like I said, every five\nyears I get itchy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3355.76,3360.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2390","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I got itchy and decided to\nleave.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3360.36,3365.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2391","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that was 1995.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3366.28,3367.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2392","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3371.64,3372.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2393","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You joined in reference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3372.56,3374.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2394","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes, well, there's twice in my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3376.32,3378.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2395","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"life where I've taken jobs that\nwere really a mistake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3378.42,3381.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2396","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I think that was one of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3382.36,3383.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2397","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It looked kind of cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3383.86,3385.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2398","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But first of all, it was in\nSunnyvale, so I had to commute","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3390.06,3393.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2399","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from Berkeley, which was, I don't\nlike to drive, and so that was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3393.34,3397.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2400","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"terrible.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3397.28,3397.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2401","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the other thing was, the guy","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3397.8,3401.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2402","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who founded it turns out didn't\nseem to know what the product was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3401.8,3409.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2403","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that he was trying to build.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3409.12,3410.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2404","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so every time I was the chief","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3412.0,3415.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2405","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"technology officer and at that\npoint I had kind of a name so he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3415.08,3418.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2406","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"always wanted to strut me out to\nshow people that we had this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3418.48,3423.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2407","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"techie guy on his staff and I\nlearned to keep my mouth shut","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3424.32,3428.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2408","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"until I found out what the product\nwas today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3430.4,3433.547"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2409","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then I had to ad lib it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3435.06,3437.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2410","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that was just kind of a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3438.4,3443.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2411","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"disaster.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3443.94,3444.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2412","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I ended up leaving that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3445.84,3448.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2413","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It ended up getting sold off to\nanother place which was an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3449.44,3455.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2414","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"internet ad company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3455.02,3456.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2415","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So in reference turned into an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3456.76,3458.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2416","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"internet ad company but that was\nafter I left.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3458.36,3461.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2417","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Trust me I wouldn't do that to\nyou.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3461.1,3463.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2418","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what happened when you left in\nreference?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3465.72,3468.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2419","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, that was a painful\nexperience, both between the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3470.14,3478.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2420","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"commute and the uncertainty of the\njob and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3478.84,3482.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2421","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I realized I had enough money\nin the bank that I could probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3482.92,3487.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2422","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"survive for six months without too\nmuch trouble.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3487.6,3491.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2423","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I was basically acting as a\nconsultant and I was working on I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3495.34,3501.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2424","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"wrote, co-authored a book on send\nmail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3501.14,3504.874"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2425","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That was during that time I did\nsome other well, I did other","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3505.76,3515.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2426","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"consulting a big one there being a\ncompany that wanted to do mass","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3515.22,3523.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2427","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"mailing, which, you know, now\neveryone has this, but back then","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3523.98,3530.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2428","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was a new thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3530.46,3532.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2429","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Anyway, I was here in Berkeley,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3532.74,3535.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2430","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"down at Pete's, which is two\nblocks from my house getting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3536.32,3539.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2431","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"coffee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3539.26,3539.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2432","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And who did I run into but Greg","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3540.66,3544.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2433","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Olson, same guy I'd worked with at\nBritton Lee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3544.54,3547.581"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2434","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you know, I'd had in the back\nof my head a thing of, well, maybe","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3547.8,3552.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2435","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I could get some companies\ntogether and create a consortium","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3552.38,3558.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2436","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that, you know, they'd each give\nme a small amount of money to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3559.54,3563.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2437","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"develop and maintain Sendmail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3563.32,3565.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2438","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I could hire somebody to do the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3565.6,3567.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2439","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"frontline support, which was\ntaking up more and more of my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3567.56,3570.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2440","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3570.42,3570.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2441","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, free email consulting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3571.22,3573.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2442","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was spending half my day every\nday just answering mail, most of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3573.7,3577.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2443","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"which was, see this page.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3577.36,3579.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2444","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's documented, look it up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3580.28,3582.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2445","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I had gone to some couple other\nplaces and the general attitude","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3584.7,3592.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2446","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"seemed to be, yeah, we would fund\nyou for that as long as we own it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3592.34,3597.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2447","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I'm like, no, that's not the\npoint.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3598.28,3600.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2448","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Point is, if ownership is spread\nout and nobody would go for that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3600.24,3605.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2449","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and so Greg at that point had gone\nstayed on the management route and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3606.6,3611.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2450","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"he had been you know VP of\nmarketing, and VP of engineering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3611.28,3615.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2451","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and VP of sales and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3615.36,3617.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2452","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you had all of these, this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3617.22,3618.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2453","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"background and how companies\nactually work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3618.9,3621.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2454","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I told him about this and he\nsaid, you know, I'm between jobs","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3621.6,3628.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2455","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"right now and I'm kind of doing\nbusiness consulting and I'll help","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3628.34,3632.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2456","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you write a business plan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3632.54,3633.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2457","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You could do a company, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3634.3,3636.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2458","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"just a standalone company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3636.84,3638.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2459","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so we spent that summer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3639.64,3641.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2460","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"working on a business plan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3641.54,3643.574"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2461","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And when the whole thing came","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3645.06,3649.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2462","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"together, I basically said, I'll\ngive you half the company if you'd","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3649.44,3653.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2463","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"be my CEO.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3653.42,3654.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2464","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so he did that and was a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3655.76,3659.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2465","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"really great CEO.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3659.86,3661.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2466","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And yeah, it was pretty heady.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3665.36,3670.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2467","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We made the front page of the New\nYork Times when we announced the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3671.98,3675.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2468","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3675.04,3675.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2469","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that was in March 1998.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3677.94,3680.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2470","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes, that's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3686.28,3687.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2471","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3687.52,3688.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2472","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was thinking it was earlier, but\nno, that's right.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3688.04,3691.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2473","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you know, we, SendMail had a\nreputation for being difficult to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3693.82,3700.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2474","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"configure so our first thing was\nwe'll make it easy to configure","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3700.9,3704.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2475","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and using a graphic user interface\nand so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3706.22,3709.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2476","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, well, I could go through the\nwhole history of SendMail, but","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3710.74,3716.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2477","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"probably it's only of interest to\nthree people in the world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3717.62,3720.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2478","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, if there's anything in\nparticular you're interested in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3720.06,3725.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2479","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The evolution of the company, when\nyou founded it, and what happened","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3727.82,3733.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2480","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"eventually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3733.66,3734.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2481","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And what were the key events?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3735.66,3738.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2482","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I was Chief Technology Officer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3745.08,3746.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2483","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was acting as VP of engineering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3749.7,3751.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2484","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at first but we had to get another\nVP of engineering because two","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3752.36,3758.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2485","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things actually one was part of VP\nof engineering is doing budgets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3758.68,3765.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2486","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and things like that which was not\nsomething that really got me","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3765.74,3770.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2487","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"excited.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3770.44,3770.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2488","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But the other thing was, and this","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3771.3,3774.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2489","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is probably a mistake I made at\nSendmail, the marketing department","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3774.02,3778.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2490","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at that point, I really had a\nreputation.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3778.1,3780.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2491","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the marketing department wanted\nto, you know, bring me out to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3781.02,3785.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2492","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"speak in front of customers and\nstuff, you know, at conferences,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3785.66,3790.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2493","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"etc. So, I ended up flying all\nover the world, meeting customers.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3790.38,3799.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2494","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was one time when I had been\nin Europe for, you know, probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3800.6,3805.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2495","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"four or five different countries\nin Europe, had to fly back to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3805.68,3810.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2496","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Berkeley for some meeting or\nevent, and the very next day flew","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3810.82,3815.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2497","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to Japan.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3815.76,3816.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2498","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it was kind of 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out.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3831.38,3833.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2501","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We did get some important things\ndone here.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3834.24,3838.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2502","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We came up with the Miltur\ninterface, stood for mail filter.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3838.94,3843.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2503","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that was a way to do plugins\ninto SendMail to do mail","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3844.14,3849.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2504","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"filtering, which can be arbitrary,\nbut of course the big thing back","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3849.96,3853.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2505","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then was anti-spam.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3853.86,3855.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2506","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Spam was becoming a really serious","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3856.78,3858.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2507","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3858.84,3859.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2508","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The milter interface was very","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3859.64,3862.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2509","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"successful to the extent that\nother MTAs that are out there are","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3862.64,3868.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2510","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"compatible with the SendMail\nmilters.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3868.92,3871.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2511","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I worked on some standards for\nthe IETF, the Internet Engineering","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3872.98,3878.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2512","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Task Force, which sets the\nstandards for the Internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3878.56,3882.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2513","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In particular one called DKIM,\nDomain Keys Identified Mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3883.08,3886.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2514","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3889.56,3890.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2515","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The standards process is an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3893.3,3895.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2516","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"interesting one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3895.24,3896.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2517","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I ended up, I did that and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3896.6,3899.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2518","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then decided I didn't wanna do\nstandards anymore just because it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3899.54,3903.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2519","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was tedious.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3903.48,3904.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2520","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there were some people there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3904.3,3907.9"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2521","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who were very, very difficult to\nwork with, and you couldn't get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3907.9,3912.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2522","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rid of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3912.28,3913.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2523","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So that was the end of my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3914.12,3916.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2524","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"standards career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3916.56,3917.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2525","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And then, this is gonna sound a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3918.94,3922.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2526","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"little bizarre, but one of my\nlucky breaks was I was diagnosed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3922.2,3927.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2527","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with prostate cancer.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3927.1,3928.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2528","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I know you don't think of that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3930.06,3934.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2529","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"as a lucky break, but I was 51,\n52, I think then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3934.28,3939.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2530","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I decided I would have\nsurgery.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3940.16,3946.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2531","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there was, of course, a\nrecovery period from surgery.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3947.66,3950.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2532","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I ended up taking some time\noff and eventually went to part","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3952.92,3957.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2533","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3957.72,3958.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2534","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that got me a little bit away","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3960.82,3964.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2535","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and you know, I continued working\nthere for a while but realized","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3964.16,3969.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2536","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that I'd come in once a week and\nsay hi to people but that was not","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3969.44,3974.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2537","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"all I was doing and I don't like\ndoing jobs which are nothing, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3974.76,3979.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2538","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"know, getting paid to do nothing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3979.28,3981.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2539","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Didn't sit well with me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3983.24,3984.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2540","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So at that some point I left\nSendmail, which was right about","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3984.6,3990.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2541","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the time it was acquired by\nProofpoint.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3990.56,3992.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2542","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And things worked out pretty well\nactually.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3994.04,3998.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2543","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The customers, all the products\ncontinued to be supported.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=3999.14,4002.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2544","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The employees, except for upper\nmanagement, kept their jobs.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4003.52,4007.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2545","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, it was, you know,\nI'm kind of sorry that Sendmail","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4009.6,4014.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2546","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"didn't turn into a big star, but\nit wasn't adequate result.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4014.66,4021.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2547","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Unfortunately, the investors,\nmyself included, didn't do very","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4022.74,4026.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2548","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4026.92,4027.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2549","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what did you do when you left","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4035.82,4038.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2550","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SendMail?\nYeah, that was the second time I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4038.08,4044.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2551","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"made a kind of job mistake.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4044.16,4047.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2552","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I went to work at a company in San","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4050.66,4053.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2553","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Francisco, which perhaps I\nshouldn't name, but doing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4053.24,4057.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2554","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"streaming database queries.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4060.68,4061.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2555","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So taking SQL and instead of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4062.4,4067.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2556","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"having it say, here's the data,\nyou know, tell me what the average","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4067.22,4070.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2557","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"salary is, it would watch the data\nas it came through, computing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4070.92,4074.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2558","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things and picking out other\nthings, which was actually an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4075.68,4079.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2559","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"interesting idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4079.64,4080.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2560","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's actually a pretty good idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4080.56,4082.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2561","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it was, the coding was all in\nC++, a language that I despise,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4082.9,4087.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2562","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and Java, a language which I\ndidn't really know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4088.72,4092.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2563","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the management at that company\nwas very, very proud of the fact","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4092.98,4097.979"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2564","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that they had a million lines of\nsource code.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4097.979,4101.399"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2565","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And they're like, ooh, we're gonna\ntell everyone how much source code","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4101.7,4104.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2566","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we have.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4104.62,4104.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2567","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the engineers are all going,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4104.96,4106.479"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2568","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"no, don't do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4106.479,4108.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2569","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We have a million lines of source","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4109.6,4111.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2570","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"code because we couldn't figure\nout how to make it smaller.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4111.2,4114.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2571","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so that was a very\ndemoralizing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4116.76,4119.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2572","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think I did one, you know, made\none innovation where I discovered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4119.64,4124.819"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2573","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"an N squared algorithm in the\nthing, but which was, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4124.819,4129.779"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2574","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that's a big deal.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4129.779,4131.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2575","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I felt like I wasn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4133.6,4135.359"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2576","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"succeeding very well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4136.899,4138.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2577","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I was thinking, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4138.04,4139.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2578","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"maybe after all that time at\nSendmail where I basically wasn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4139.54,4143.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2579","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"writing any code anymore and maybe\nI just couldn't do it anymore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4143.08,4146.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2580","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I ended up putting my tail\nbetween my legs and gave that one","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4146.779,4153.279"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2581","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4153.279,4153.779"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2582","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"In 2011 you kind of retired.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4155.939,4159.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2583","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what did you do?\nWell, yeah, I I did actually try","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4160.14,4164.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2584","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to retire I.. you know did some\nbut I was basically saying okay,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4164.72,4174.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2585","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know at this point I've got\nenough money in the bank.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4174.92,4178.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2586","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, Sendmail was paying me\npretty well, but I live a pretty","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4178.859,4183.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2587","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"frugal lifestyle.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4183.2,4184.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2588","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I had actually amassed a nice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4184.34,4188.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2589","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"nest egg.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4188.46,4189.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2590","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so back in my mammoth days,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4190.859,4197.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2591","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"one of the things that happened\nwas the computer science","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4198.82,4201.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2592","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"department moved into a new\nbuilding and so all of those","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4201.56,4206.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2593","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"computers and things that I was\ntalking about had to move from the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4206.56,4210.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2594","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"old building into the new building\nand the new building had to have a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4210.44,4214.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2595","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"whole new network and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4214.86,4217.587"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2596","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I worked with another staff","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4219.38,4222.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2597","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"member, a guy named Ken Lutz, who\nas near as I can tell has worked","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4222.04,4228.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2598","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on every interesting project that\nBerkeley has ever done in computer","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4228.74,4231.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2599","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"science.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4231.96,4232.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2600","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He's, you know, did RAID and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4232.36,4234.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2601","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"network abort stations and all\nthese really cool projects.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4234.2,4237.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2602","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I ran into him, actually, no, I\ndidn't run into him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4238.4,4241.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2603","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He called me, I guess, and said,\nyou know, Eric, I'm working at a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4241.32,4248.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2604","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"new research lab called the Swarm\nLab at Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4248.62,4253.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2605","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there's some stuff going on\nhere I think you might find","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4253.5,4256.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2606","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4256.76,4257.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2607","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we have seminars at lunchtime","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4257.8,4260.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2608","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on Thursdays, free lunch.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4260.36,4261.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2609","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Why don't you come up and see what","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4262.14,4263.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2610","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we're doing?\" I went, well sure,\nokay, free lunch, got me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4263.62,4267.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2611","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I went up and indeed it was\nvery interesting.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4269.22,4273.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2612","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Now this was the first time I've\nbeen in a lab which looked like a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4273.24,4278.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2613","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"lab.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4278.16,4278.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2614","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This is where they have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4278.84,4280.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2615","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"oscilloscopes and signal\ngenerators and microscopes and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4280.46,4287.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2616","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"heavy duty chemicals and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4287.26,4289.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2617","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I was a software guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4290.02,4291.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2618","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it was still really\ninteresting stuff.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4291.32,4293.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2619","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I ended up hanging out at a\nresearch project and at some point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4294.24,4300.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2620","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was hanging out enough that they\nended up hiring me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4300.24,4304.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2621","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I went back to work, working\nfor the university.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4305.06,4309.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2622","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so that I believe will be the\nlast job of my career unless","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4310.82,4315.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2623","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"something changes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4315.74,4316.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2624","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I bracketed my career with","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4316.64,4320.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2625","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"university jobs, which, you know,\nI'm not unhappy about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4320.44,4326.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2626","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I do have to say like I said\nafter I finished with the previous","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4327.72,4332.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2627","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"company I was really kind of\ndemoralized, convinced that I just","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4332.56,4337.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2628","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"couldn't program anymore.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4337.96,4339.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2629","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I ended up writing most of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4341.34,4343.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2630","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"code for that research project and\nkind of got my mojo back.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4343.32,4348.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2631","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it was a good job and I loved\nworking with him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4349.6,4353.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2632","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He was absolutely fabulous guy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4353.56,4356.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2633","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So during your career, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4359.78,4361.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2634","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"received many honors and in\nparticular, In 2014, you were","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4361.24,4369.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2635","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"inducted to the Internet Hall of\nFame.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4369.2,4371.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2636","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4373.24,4373.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2637","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did you expect that?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4374.24,4375.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2638","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Did I expect that?\nNot at all.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4376.74,4381.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2639","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, I don't quite remember how\nit even came about but yeah, I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4384.7,4390.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2640","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"flew to Hong Kong for that\nceremony and you know, they they","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4390.38,4394.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2641","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"made a big deal out of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4394.3,4395.686"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2642","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And they end up having a whole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4395.94,4404.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2643","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bunch of really interesting\npeople.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4404.76,4407.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2644","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It turns out I already personally\nknew some of the inductees,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4407.1,4411.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2645","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"including Paul Bixey, who was\ninducted the same time I was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4413.28,4417.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2646","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So he and I ran around Hong Kong\ntogether.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4417.28,4419.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2647","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That was pretty cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4419.28,4420.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2648","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And yeah, you know, it was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4427.86,4429.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2649","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"obviously for internet mail.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4429.94,4431.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2650","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And they had some clever way of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4433.1,4436.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2651","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"making it sound more important\nthan it actually was.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4436.58,4438.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2652","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But there you go.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4438.86,4440.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2653","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You have been involved in Usenix","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4447.06,4448.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2654","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"since the 70s, 1970s.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4449.52,4452.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2655","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4454.2,4454.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2656","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What have been your roles in the\nyears?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4455.04,4458.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2657","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, so I started just attending\nUSENIX.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4460.86,4467.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2658","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The first USENIX I went to was in\nSan Francisco.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4467.78,4470.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2659","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Tom Ferron, who I mentioned\nearlier, was chairing that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4471.86,4478.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2660","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"conference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4478.8,4479.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2661","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it was an amazingly wonderful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4479.9,4483.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2662","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"conference.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4483.48,4483.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2663","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's like you know I'm with my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4483.94,4486.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2664","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"people here This is great and so I\nstarted going to more conferences","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4486.24,4492.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2665","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and eventually I ended up on the\nboard of directors and did that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4492.54,4500.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2666","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for several years and several\ndifferent roles I think I was Vice","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4500.8,4506.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2667","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"President at one point and\nTreasurer another point.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4506.14,4508.887"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2668","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But there are term limits on the\nusing sport, which is a good","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4510.28,4513.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2669","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"thing.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4513.34,4513.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2670","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I believe in term limits and so","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4513.52,4515.372"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2671","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm still however on the audit\ncommittee.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4518.82,4521.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2672","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So every year we get together and\ngo through the audits of the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4521.82,4525.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2673","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"finances to make sure there's no\nhanky-panky going on.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4525.72,4530.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2674","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'm still connected with these\nthings.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4531.18,4533.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2675","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So you publish several papers,\nbooks, articles.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4536.28,4541.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2676","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What is the publication you are\nmost proud of?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4542.66,4547.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2677","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I don't know that I\nwould say pride exactly.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4550.38,4554.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2678","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know some of them have been\nimportant.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4558.78,4559.509"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2679","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's been you know papers that\ncame out with important.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4559.509,4560.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2680","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's been papers that came out\nassociated with Ingress that have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4562.06,4570.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2681","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"made an impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4570.58,4571.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2682","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was on the editorial review","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4573.68,4577.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2683","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"board of, not unit review, that's\na different one, of ACM Q","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4577.54,4583.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2684","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Magazine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4583.24,4583.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2685","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And as a result of being on that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4584.62,4586.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2686","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"board, wrote a lot of articles for\nQ, which was designed more for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4586.2,4590.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2687","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"practitioners.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4591.06,4591.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2688","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So it wasn't, you know, hardcore","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4591.86,4593.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2689","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bits and bytes.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4593.8,4594.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2690","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And one of those, managing","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4595.9,4599.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2691","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"technical debt, turns out to now\nbe probably my most referenced","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4599.02,4604.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2692","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"paper ever.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4604.38,4607.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2693","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"People are referencing it all over","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4608.78,4610.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2694","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the place.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4610.28,4610.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2695","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I think it's a good","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4611.18,4612.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2696","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"paper, you know, article, really,\nnot a paper.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4612.96,4615.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2697","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I don't quite understand why\nthat's more important than some of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4616.04,4619.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2698","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the other ones I've done.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4619.12,4620.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2699","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, obviously, the Sendmail","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4622.26,4623.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2700","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"book was a big deal at the time.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4623.76,4627.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2701","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It was a...","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4627.54,4628.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2702","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"O'Reilly and Associates said it\nwas their best-selling book for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4629.06,4632.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2703","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"several years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4632.38,4633.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2704","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So Brian Costales was the primary","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4636.5,4639.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2705","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"author on that, so I can't really\ntake the credit for that one.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4639.14,4642.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2706","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't know.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4648.84,4649.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2707","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I mean, I try and do, I try and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4651.0,4656.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2708","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"feel at least not embarrassed by\nanything I publish.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4657.26,4660.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2709","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I don't know if that means\nproud.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4660.68,4663.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2710","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I guess it's more important what\nhas actually had impact and Those","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4665.94,4671.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2711","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"two things are probably the ones\nthat have had the most impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4671.28,4673.681"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2712","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So what activities have you\npursued recently?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4675.44,4679.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2713","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, well I retired from the\nuniversity in and you know really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4681.98,4689.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2714","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"retired from the university this\ntime as in, you know, I'm getting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4689.8,4692.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2715","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a pension.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4692.62,4693.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2716","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so, you know, I still do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4695.56,4698.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2717","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"technology work and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4699.02,4702.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2718","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm a wine collector.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4702.36,4703.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2719","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I built a database to store\nthe inventory of our wine cellar.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4704.32,4709.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2720","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's all in Python, which\nwas a language I had to learn in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4710.86,4715.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2721","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"order to do this.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4715.08,4716.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2722","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I'm kind of the default system","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4718.48,4720.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2723","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"administrator for the house, which\nI kind of hate, but somebody has","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4720.58,4726.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2724","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4726.88,4727.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2725","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I got involved in a place called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4729.34,4732.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2726","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the Hillside, Berkeley Hillside\nClub, several years ago,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4732.04,4735.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2727","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"originally just as a member.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4736.32,4737.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2728","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hillside Club is a member","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4738.84,4741.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2729","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"organization focusing on basically\nart, architecture, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4741.16,4748.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2730","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"certain current event things,\nclimate change, et cetera.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4748.94,4754.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2731","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And at some point ended up, I\ndidn't get out of the way fast","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4758.52,4764.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2732","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"enough and I ended up being\nelected to the board.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4764.16,4766.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2733","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I just literally a few days\nago, turned out and I ultimately","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4767.88,4773.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2734","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"ended up as President.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4773.76,4775.063"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2735","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I'm this President for two","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4776.82,4779.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2736","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"years and I'm gratified that many\npeople have told me that I was","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4779.86,4785.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2737","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"actually a good President.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4785.34,4786.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2738","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I almost feel like now that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4786.72,4788.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2739","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I've retired, I may have gotten\nthis management thing working.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4788.84,4792.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2740","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And actually after swearing I\nwould never start another company","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4798.24,4801.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2741","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"again in my life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4801.72,4802.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2742","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I started another company called","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4802.64,4805.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2743","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the, it's a not-for-profit called\nthe Berkeley Historic Building","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4805.14,4809.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2744","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Fund.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4809.02,4809.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2745","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it's to collect money to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4811.12,4814.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2746","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"maintain historic buildings,\nincluding the building that the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4814.84,4818.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2747","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Hillside Club is in.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4818.6,4820.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2748","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we are interested in getting a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4821.34,4824.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2749","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"new roof and things like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4824.96,4826.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2750","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'm kind of doing, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4826.92,4830.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2751","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"more social things now, not so\nmuch serious tech.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4830.32,4834.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2752","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay, let's go back to many years\nago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4837.42,4842.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2753","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So In 1976, you came out of the\ncloset.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4843.38,4847.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2754","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You already mentioned your\npartner.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4848.48,4850.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2755","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But what I wanted to ask you is,\nwhat happened in 1976?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4850.9,4856.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2756","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"How you did it and what was its\nimpact in those days, in the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4856.98,4861.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2757","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"mid-70s?\nI was in an emotionally very, very","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4861.64,4870.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2758","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bad way.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4870.16,4870.96"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2759","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I won't go into the gory details,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4871.12,4872.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2760","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"but it became very clear to me\nthat I had to come out and I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4873.08,4880.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2761","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"didn't even want to consider the\nalternative.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4880.6,4882.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2762","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that was probably the best\ndecision I've ever made in my","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4886.76,4893.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2763","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"life.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4893.84,4894.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2764","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I lost some friends.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4897.74,4899.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2765","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, when I came out of the\ncloset, I didn't just like open","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4901.24,4906.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2766","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the door, I used dynamite to blow\nit open.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4906.24,4909.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2767","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I was working on the Ingress\nProject back then.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4910.46,4913.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2768","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And there were some people who\nwere clearly concerned about that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4913.04,4920.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2769","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But a whole bunch of the other\npeople were like, yay for you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4920.78,4926.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2770","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And some of those people remained\nsome of my best friends.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4927.08,4929.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2771","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But more importantly, I think I\nmentioned kind of an angry","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4931.76,4938.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2772","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"personality for a while.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4938.74,4940.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2773","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, some of that was, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4942.04,4944.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2774","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"know, frankly, I got some of it\nfrom my father, but a lot of it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4944.52,4950.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2775","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was just pent up, you know,\nself-hatred, I guess.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4950.44,4954.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2776","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that let me open up.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4955.66,4961.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2777","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, You know, like I said, there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4965.48,4967.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2778","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"were people who, you know, I lost,\nbut it gave me a path to being an","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4967.38,4977.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2779","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"easier to get along with person.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4977.5,4979.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2780","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so I think it, you know,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4981.38,4983.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2781","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"completely changed my personality.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4983.22,4984.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2782","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm much less of an asshole than I","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4985.66,4987.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2783","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was before.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4987.54,4988.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2784","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, I did at some point","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4990.84,4994.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2785","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"meet a guy who was actually a\nstudent at Berkeley.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=4995.78,5000.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2786","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I was still on the Ingress\nproject, but I was out at that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5000.44,5004.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2787","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"point and at the time he was in\nthe closet and so it didn't go","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5004.72,5011.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2788","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well and for a couple of years if\nwe saw each other in the hallway,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5011.56,5017.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2789","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"we'd both turn around and walk the\nother direction.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5017.64,5019.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2790","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But then went to a gay students\nunion meeting once, which I almost","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5021.6,5028.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2791","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"never did, but I did that day and\nwho would be in the room but the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5028.64,5032.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2792","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"same guy, tried to hide behind a\npillow.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5032.8,5035.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2793","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And we've been together ever\nsince, 44 years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5037.12,5040.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2794","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So in 1998, you said in an\ninterview, there is some sort of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5042.26,5049.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2795","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"perverse pleasure in knowing that\nit's basically impossible to send","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5049.06,5054.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2796","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"a piece of hate mail out through\nthe internet without...(voice gets","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5054.54,5058.785"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2797","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"cut) Yeah, that was a period where\nthere was a lot of sort of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5058.785,5074.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2798","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Christian fundamentalism that\nsomehow was sneaking into the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5074.02,5077.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2799","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"technology world.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5077.08,5078.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2800","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Somebody was proposing a new","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5078.94,5082.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2801","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"version of Unix called Yazix, I\nthink.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5082.28,5086.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2802","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And you know, there would be no\nkill command because you know to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5087.38,5091.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2803","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"kill as a sin so they renamed that\nand they obviously they had to get","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5091.3,5095.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2804","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"rid of some mail because it was\nwritten by what do they say a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5095.32,5100.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2805","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"well-known gay activist or\nsomething like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5100.48,5104.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2806","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I don't remember exactly what it\nwas.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5104.76,5106.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2807","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I can't even remember when or\nwhere I said that or to whom, But","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5108.74,5115.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2808","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it was just kind of an offhanded,\nyou know, aside.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5116.26,5120.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2809","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Sendmail survived and Yazix or\nwhatever they were calling it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5123.5,5127.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2810","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"didn't.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5127.72,5128.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2811","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I win.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5128.44,5130.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2812","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Would you like to say anything\nelse about your husband?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5136.36,5139.875"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2813","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Sure, Kirk McKusick, another kind\nof luminary.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5143.02,5147.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2814","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I know you've interviewed him.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5147.3,5148.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2815","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He shared an office with Bill Joy,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5150.64,5153.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2816","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"so I knew Bill pretty well.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5154.52,5156.394"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2817","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He's one of those people he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5156.394,5164.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2818","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Actually what he it's PhD was in\ntable driven register allocation","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5165.4,5171.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2819","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for compilers, something like\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5171.84,5174.08"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2820","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Something that he has used, I\nthink, once in his career.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5175.06,5178.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2821","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Although it turns out that his PhD\nthesis is now referenced by a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5179.7,5185.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2822","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bunch of people because as\ncomputers get to the point where","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5185.12,5188.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2823","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"they have more and more registers,\nthe algorithms that he came up","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5188.04,5192.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2824","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with are completely the right\nthings, but that's not what he's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5192.78,5195.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2825","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"working on He started working on\nthe file system for Unix.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5195.38,5198.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2826","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Once again, Bill Joy saying \"hey\nKirk, you know, why don't you work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5198.44,5203.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2827","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"on this?\" and Bill was really good\nat getting other people to do","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5203.42,5210.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2828","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5210.16,5210.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2829","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he wrote what was called at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5212.76,5216.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2830","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the time the FAST file system.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5216.26,5218.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2831","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's now been renamed UFS, the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5218.68,5221.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2832","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Unix file system, because it's\nessentially the default Unix file","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5221.5,5226.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2833","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"system for everyone.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5226.06,5227.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2834","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But he's kept on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5230.52,5232.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2835","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he has added all kinds of\nstuff, Background FSCK, for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5232.86,5243.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2836","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"example, so you didn't have to\nwait forever for the system to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5243.26,5247.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2837","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"reboot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5247.04,5247.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2838","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And snapshots, so you could get a","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5248.86,5251.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2839","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"backup of a clean file system that\nwasn't changing out from under you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5251.62,5256.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2840","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"and and and and and and.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5256.04,5258.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2841","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He's done recently a bunch of work","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5258.8,5263.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2842","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"for Netflix, kind of\ncounterintuitive.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5263.38,5267.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2843","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Netflix uses this file system to\ndistribute the actual movies that","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5268.66,5275.64"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2844","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"are on the internet.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5276.32,5277.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2845","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the discs that they use, every","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5280.4,5283.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2846","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"day they rewrite them in the\nmiddle of the night predicting","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5283.14,5286.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2847","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what is going to be valuable the\nnext day and so if a disc dies we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5286.44,5292.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2848","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"have as many discs as Netflix does\nthere's always a dead disc They","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5292.7,5297.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2849","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"didn't want the whole system to\ncrash.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5297.32,5299.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2850","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"They just wanted the system to\nsay, oh, that disk went away,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5299.12,5302.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2851","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"okay, I'll just skip over that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5302.66,5305.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2852","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so they actually paid him to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5305.76,5308.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2853","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"do that work on the condition that\nit go into the open source.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5308.94,5312.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2854","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So the whole world benefits from\nthat.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5313.26,5316.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2855","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So yeah, he's still working on\nfile systems.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5316.92,5319.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2856","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Have you ever worked together or\ncollaborated on a project?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5321.72,5325.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2857","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, many of them.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5331.54,5333.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2858","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, I kind of worked on Trek","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5334.52,5336.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2859","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with Steve, Steve Warren.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5336.6,5342.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2860","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The ADIT project had multiple","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5348.42,5352.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2861","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"programmers on it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5352.44,5353.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2862","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There was one guy in particular,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5353.52,5354.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2863","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"uh, who, uh, kind of, we did kind\nof co-coding for big chunks of it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5355.9,5364.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2864","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So we'd actually go into the\noffice at night when we wouldn't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5364.96,5368.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2865","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"get interrupted and spend all\nnight, you know, two computers in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5368.0,5372.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2866","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the office and working on the\ncode, handing stuff back and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5372.78,5378.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2867","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5378.26,5378.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2868","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yeah, there's been lots of people","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5382.04,5383.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2869","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"who I've done some kind of work\nwith.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5384.04,5387.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2870","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That experience with the, with,\num, at Britain Lee was probably","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5388.82,5394.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2871","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the tightest I've ever worked with\nanyone before.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5395.0,5397.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2872","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Others have been, you know, the\nsurgical team model where there's,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5399.54,5407.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2873","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you know, one guy in charge and\nother people who are scattered","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5407.3,5411.48"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2874","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"around the side.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5411.48,5412.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2875","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Husband?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5417.32,5417.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2876","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"With Kirk?\nOne thing about a successful","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5419.94,5424.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2877","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"relationship is it may be\nimportant to not work too","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5424.52,5427.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2878","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"intimately on projects.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5427.62,5429.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2879","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"There's a lot of stuff we've done","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5430.52,5432.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2880","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"together, you know, carpentry\naround the house and so forth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5432.02,5435.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2881","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But it's like cooking together.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5436.16,5437.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2882","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We learned a long time ago that we","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5438.24,5440.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2883","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"can cook together as long as we\nknow who's making dinner and who's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5440.38,5444.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2884","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"helping.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5444.72,5445.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2885","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And it trades off which is which.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5446.28,5448.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2886","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Doesn't really matter, it's not\nlike one of us has to be in","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5449.3,5452.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2887","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"control all the time, but if we\ntry and negotiate everything, it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5452.8,5460.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2888","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"can be a problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5460.14,5461.2"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2889","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Bigly I agree with you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5462.86,5464.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2890","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, what is your main motivation\nin supporting free and open source","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5464.96,5473.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2891","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"software?\nYou know, if I'm going to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5473.58,5484.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2892","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"gallant, I'll make some comment\nabout making the world a better","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5484.72,5488.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2893","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"place, etc., etc. If I'm going to\nbe a little more honest, I think","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5488.82,5492.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2894","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it's just because I really love it\nwhen people use the stuff I've","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5492.12,5495.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2895","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"written.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5495.86,5496.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2896","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the easiest way to do that is","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5497.5,5499.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2897","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to give it away.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5499.14,5500.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2898","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I have, my whole career, I have","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5501.32,5506.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2899","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"not gone for the jobs that make\nthe most money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5506.82,5509.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2900","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I've gone to the jobs that most\ninterest me, you know, and assumed","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5510.02,5514.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2901","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"that the money would sort of\nfollow along.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5515.02,5518.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2902","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And, you know, I could be way, way\nricher than I am right now.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5518.08,5522.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2903","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But why?\nI've got enough money that I can","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5523.74,5528.36"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2904","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"retire comfortably, and I can't\nbuy islands or fly private jets or","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5528.36,5533.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2905","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"anything like that.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5533.78,5534.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2906","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I'm happy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5536.0,5536.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2907","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And so, yeah, just having people\nuse the work.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5537.6,5544.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2908","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I love it when somebody\ncomes up and says, oh, I use, you","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5544.1,5549.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2909","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"know, whatever, Sendmail,\nwhatever, and you know, I loved","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5549.06,5552.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2910","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5552.44,5552.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2911","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That just makes me all warm","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5554.46,5555.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2912","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"inside.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5555.88,5556.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2913","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So if you look at your life, what","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5558.4,5560.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2914","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"is the thing you're the most proud\nof?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5560.4,5564.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2915","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Most proud of in my life, it's,\nI'm tempted to say coming out of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5572.7,5576.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2916","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"the closet because it made my life\na lot better and frankly the lives","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5576.88,5583.28"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2917","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"of other people around me a lot\nbetter.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5583.28,5585.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2918","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SendMail obviously had an\nincredible impact.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5587.94,5590.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2919","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"SendMail is still out there on the\ninternet but it's nowhere near the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5590.84,5596.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2920","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"market share that it used to have.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5596.9,5598.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2921","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"That's okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5598.56,5599.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2922","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Syslog turned out to be really,\nreally important.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5599.74,5603.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2923","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And once again, it's been\nrewritten.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5604.1,5605.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2924","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's not my code anymore, but it\nwas my idea.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5605.52,5608.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2925","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, the environment at the\ncomputer science department at","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5612.3,5616.72"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2926","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Berkeley, where I had something to\ndo with building it, I'm really","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5616.72,5621.92"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2927","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"proud of.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5621.92,5622.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2928","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It really improved the ability for","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5624.22,5628.34"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2929","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"researchers to get their jobs done\nacross the entire department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5628.34,5631.38"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2930","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It wasn't just my group, it was\nthe whole department.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5631.38,5634.78"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2931","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's really pretty cool.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5635.68,5637.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2932","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, the honors and stuff","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5641.22,5642.88"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2933","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"don't mean that much to me.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5644.4,5645.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2934","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know, I mean, it's nice to be","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5646.04,5647.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2935","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"recognized, but it's not like I,\nyou know, have plaques all around","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5647.58,5653.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2936","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"my office, you know, showing off\nthe awards that I've gotten.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5653.32,5657.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2937","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that's tacky.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5657.58,5658.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2938","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"What advice would you give to","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5664.56,5666.18"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2939","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"someone willing to pursue a career\ntoday?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5666.18,5669.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2940","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Well, it depends on what your\ngoals in life are, I guess.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5676.54,5679.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2941","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Like it's said, I've done the bit\nof going on and doing whole","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5681.28,5689.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2942","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"bunches of different things, which\nmeans I've learned a lot, means","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5689.54,5692.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2943","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm probably never the best at\nanything at any given time because","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5692.76,5697.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2944","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I'm the one who's learning about\nit.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5697.92,5700.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2945","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But there's a famous guy, won the\nTuring Award, Jim Gray, who sadly","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5701.3,5709.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2946","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"was lost at sea several years ago.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5710.32,5712.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2947","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And Jim was a friend of mine.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5712.88,5714.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2948","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And his thing was doing massive\ndatabases.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5715.44,5719.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2949","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he would pick something that\nhad never been done before and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5721.04,5725.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2950","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"then do it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5726.26,5727.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2951","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And these things were earth","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5728.12,5732.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2952","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"changing, in some senses quite\nliterally.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5732.04,5734.32"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2953","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maps, the database technology that\nwe have to store maps that you use","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5734.62,5740.4"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2954","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"from everyone today was developed\nby Jim.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5740.4,5744.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2955","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And the thing about Jim was he,\nwhen he went into a new thing, he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5745.72,5751.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2956","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"didn't just say, okay, what's the,\nwhat do I as a computer scientist","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5751.44,5755.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2957","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"need to know?\nHe said he wants to understand the","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5756.0,5759.54"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2958","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"technology or the science that is\napplied.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5759.54,5764.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2959","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So his last project was working on\nthe sky map, said, you know, well,","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5765.08,5771.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2960","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"what's bigger than the whole\nplanet?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5771.04,5772.74"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2961","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Oh, how about the whole universe?\nAnd when he was honored after he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5772.74,5781.22"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2962","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"passed away, somebody on that\nproject said, Jim came in and he","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5781.22,5786.58"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2963","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"said, I want to learn about\nastronomy, not what's your data","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5786.58,5789.98"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2964","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"problem.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5789.98,5790.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2965","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"He said, I want to understand","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5790.42,5791.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2966","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"astronomy.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5791.92,5792.42"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2967","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And he started actually making","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5792.56,5794.3"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2968","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"serious contributions to the\nproject.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5794.3,5796.6"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2969","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"I think that's great.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5799.52,5800.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2970","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And if you can do it, that's","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5800.76,5804.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2971","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"wonderful.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5804.02,5804.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2972","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I remember chatting with him","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5804.54,5808.0"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2973","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"at some point, and he was working\nat Microsoft, and he said, they're","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5808.0,5812.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2974","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"paying me an obscene amount of\nmoney for work that I would","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5812.12,5816.46"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2975","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"happily do for free if they just\ngave me the resources to do it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5816.46,5821.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2976","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"with.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5821.12,5821.62"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2977","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"This was a perfect life and so if","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5822.64,5825.02"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2978","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"you can get the perfect life, go\nfor it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5825.02,5827.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2979","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"You know other people like Kirk\nare very happy to you know kind of","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5828.8,5833.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2980","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"carve out this area and you know\nif you carve out an area don't","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5833.82,5837.8"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2981","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"make it too small don't make it\ntoo big.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5837.8,5840.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2982","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, yeah, I would definitely say\nyou know followed the interest","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5846.84,5852.82"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2983","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"don't follow the money obviously,\nwe need enough to be able to put","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5852.94,5858.86"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2984","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"food in the refrigerator and so\nforth.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5858.86,5861.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2985","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I think a lot of people going\ninto deep learning AI today are","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5864.76,5870.68"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2986","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"doing it because they think\nthere's, data scientists are going","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5870.68,5876.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2987","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to make a huge amount of money.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5876.84,5878.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2988","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that's true, some of them","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5879.06,5880.66"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2989","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will, but there's so many people\ngoing into it right now that there","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5880.66,5884.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2990","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"will be a glut of data scientists\nin a few years.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5884.24,5887.04"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2991","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I did neural networks when\nneural networks were out of favor.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5891.04,5895.52"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2992","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And I kind of like doing stuff\nthat is not popular and having it","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5898.24,5903.16"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2993","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"become popular later.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5903.16,5904.56"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2994","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"The database interfaces, graphical","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5905.68,5908.76"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2995","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"database interfaces that I\nmentioned earlier, you know, three","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5908.84,5912.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2996","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"years later that's what everyone\nwanted.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5912.26,5915.361"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2997","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"And that VP of marketing was an\nidiot.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5916.42,5918.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2998","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So, do something exciting, do\nsomething that's challenging, and","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5921.82,5931.24"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/2999","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"enjoy it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5931.58,5932.44"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3000","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Is there anything you would like","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5936.04,5937.84"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3001","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"to add that you haven't covered\ntoday?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5937.84,5940.059"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3002","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Probably tons of things.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5940.059,5942.61"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3003","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"But I was thinking of something","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5942.61,5953.94"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3004","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"earlier, but I've lost it.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5953.94,5955.1"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3005","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"So I'm just going to say no. Okay.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5955.1,5959.14"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3006","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"We can cover this in another\ninterview, perhaps?","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5960.2,5963.5"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3007","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Maybe.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5964.56,5965.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3008","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Okay, so thank you.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5968.18,5970.26"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3009","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's been a real pleasure talking\nto you today.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5970.78,5974.06"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3010","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Yes, it's been a pleasure talking\nwith you too.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5975.02,5977.12"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3011","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"It's kind of fun to reminisce.","format":"text/plain"},"target":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413#t=5977.12,5978.7"},{"id":"https://fossda.aviaryplatform.com/collections/1633/collection_resources/106636/file/207413/transcript/49303/annotation/3012","type":"Annotation","motivation":"transcribing","body":{"type":"TextualBody","value":"Thank you very 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